Supplementary Material 14: Return to the Gurusphere
Added 2024-08-31 05:19:35 +0000 UTCWorld travels complete the Guru Decoders reconvene to examine how the Gurusphere has been behaving in their absence. Bad news abounds.
Featuring:
Introduction and Hosts' Reunion
Chris's Travel Tales Cultural Observations and Comparisons
Health Concerns and Anti-Vax Movement
RFK Jr. and Political Endorsements
Quarantine Measures in History
Bret Weinstein endorses Trump
Eric Weinstein's quasi-endorsement
Stephen Bartlett promotes Bret and gets in trouble for ads
Plagiarism Allegations against Robin Di Angelo
Elon Musk's Twitter Investors Revealed
Konstantin Kisin vs. a normal Interview
Jonathan Pageau and 5G Conspiracies
Sam Harris & Destiny Conversation
Sam's Analysis of Jordan Peterson
Social Media Derangement: Sam vs. Destiny
Offline vs Online Behaviour
Focus on the Far Left vs. the Far Right
Closing Thoughts & Next Episode
Links
Delusions, Right and Left: A Conversation with “Destiny” (Steven Bonnell) (Episode #381)
Fortune: Elon Musk was just forced to reveal who really owns X. Here’s the list
BBC: Steven Bartlett nutrition adverts banned for being misleading
Comments
https://www.vox.com/politics/370323/tenet-media-russia-what-happened-tim-pool-dave-rubin-benny-johnson-lauren-southern Maybe worth a look for future SM
Peter Cilek
2024-09-06 08:36:11 +0000 UTCLike if everything that he freaks out about is a nonsense story, his epistemology is terrible, why should anyone listen to him. Just a reactionary clown.
Anonymous ethicist, not a serial killer at all, just asking questions.
2024-09-03 15:54:19 +0000 UTCAh Sam Harris: I'm concerned about the left because of a fox news story I misremembered because it effects something I care about: academia, a place I've never spent a second in outside of my PhD. Dudes a fucking clown.
Anonymous ethicist, not a serial killer at all, just asking questions.
2024-09-03 15:51:28 +0000 UTCIf you are having trouble copying/pasting any of that, I can email it to you instead
Níall Faughnan
2024-09-03 12:26:38 +0000 UTCFirst of all get reddit enhancement suite: https://redditenhancementsuite.com/ Then on the reddit homepage: Click the cog in the top right Click 'RES settings console' Type snippet into the top left search bar Click 'CSS snippets to load' Click 'Add Row', copy the below into snippet, then click 'save options' at the top right: /* Hide Reddit comment form */ form.usertext.cloneable.warn-on-unload[onsubmit^="return post_form(this, 'comment')"] { display: none; } /* Hide specific textarea within the form */ form.usertext.cloneable.warn-on-unload[onsubmit^="return post_form(this, 'comment')"] textarea[data-event-action="comment"][data-type="link"] { display: none; } /* Hide reply button */ li.reply-button.login-required { display: none; } /* Hide reply link */ a.access-required[data-event-action="comment"][onclick="return reply(this)"] { display: none; }
Níall Faughnan
2024-09-03 12:26:05 +0000 UTCI thought this too. Asking Destiny if/how social media affects him is like asking a fish for its opinion on water. It would be impossible for social media to have not shaped his personality in ways that he wouldn't know about.
Will
2024-09-03 05:40:47 +0000 UTCI definitely suffer this same disease. The few online arguments I've engaged in live in my head rent-free until they've concluded and I'm definitely a shittier person for it. Can you shoot me that code, Niall? That never even occurred to me.
Will
2024-09-03 02:11:32 +0000 UTCDestiny is so much smarter than sam
Charlie Friedberg
2024-09-03 01:22:51 +0000 UTCSam kind of sounds like an addict in recovery, romanticizing his intense experiences with social media and sounding the alarm for his peers
Evan Strippelhoff
2024-09-02 22:49:26 +0000 UTCI can't even view twitter anymore. The one good thing about Musk's takeover. I've gone as far as editing the html code on reddit to remove the comment/reply button as I sometimes feel the compulsion.
Níall Faughnan
2024-09-02 16:36:27 +0000 UTCI share Chris’ unrealistic optimism when it comes to accomplishing more when I travel. Now I know I can blame it on my Ulster ancestry!
Amy
2024-09-02 15:08:47 +0000 UTCI sure wish I hadn’t looked up about Human Centipede. That was some seriously sadistic stuff. At least the pyramid of butt kissers are willingly part of that dynamic.
Linda Sears
2024-09-02 14:59:16 +0000 UTCI have a bad combination of being conflict avoidant and likely to get upset by that which I perceive of as bullying, unfair, and/or illogical. It’s best I keep out of it.
Linda Sears
2024-09-02 14:53:54 +0000 UTCA fun episode. Even though I'm closer to Destiny on the use of social media, I'm not sure how many people fall on our side of the fence. My partner is one of the people who twitter can ruin hours of her day (not up to an hour). Also, I read Sam as very curious about Destiny and his view while (with Chris leading the way) Sam is claiming his view is the correct one. Found that take surprising but otherwise... good episode
Dr Badmouth
2024-09-02 06:18:05 +0000 UTCGreat episode. I’ve been thinking about the topic of social media derangement. I think when Twitter brought in the “home” timeline with the algorithmic feed, it changed people’s behaviour. Although it helps people find stuff that interests them, the algorithm encourages people to make controversial tweets by amplifying them. Twitter was more boring but less addictive for me 10 years ago. I use Mastodon now. It’s like Twitter was in 2009. Clunky and boring, like me.
Eric
2024-09-02 01:42:36 +0000 UTCSame here. I always feel guilty when i voice my opinion online and offline and then I delete all of my comments because I'm fucking weird. My boyfriend on the other hand absolutely loves starting internet arguments. Maybe Maté was on something. Something something childhood trauma....
lun
2024-09-01 23:08:55 +0000 UTCI'm one of those people that can't argue on the Internet without it ruining my day. I don't know how you all do it.
Níall Faughnan
2024-09-01 20:24:21 +0000 UTCI kind of see Destiny as a person who thrives in that always online environment. He is both a product of it and a creator of it. I’m more like Sam in that being actively engaged on Twitter would be toxic because I’d get too emotional and tweet stupid things I’d regret. Sam’s issue is that he projects his own problems with something onto everyone. Not all people who engage with Twitter are demented by it. That said, I do think Twitter has become more problematic under Musk.
Linda Sears
2024-09-01 12:09:48 +0000 UTCWatchmen reference by Matt was best moment in this excellent ep. 👏
Idan Ca
2024-09-01 12:05:52 +0000 UTCHaving grown up in Switzerland I can confirm it genuinely does look like the picture on the chocolate boxes. Obviously there's lots of things that are less than idyllic, even for short-term visitors (eye-wateringly expensive, for starters), but the Alps are genuinely spectacular. Much as I love the beauty of Ireland, I have to take regular trips back to top up my "real mountains are awesome" reservoir. On Sam Harris/Destiny, takes me back to the discussion on Gabor Maté and "authenticity" not being all its cracked up to be. I think Destiny is authentically disturbing at times. I also think that Sam is authentically a self-satisfied dolt. My old jiu-jitsu sensei taught us some of the nastier techniques he reserved for bouncers on the grounds that they were "ignorant". Explaining that by "ignorant" he didn't mean lacking in knowledge (or intelligence, for that matter), but having the firm conviction that what you don't know isn't worth knowing and bull-headed refusal to learn anything new or that might challenge your pre-existing prejudices. Sam has this kind of ignorance in spades, imo. Intelligence is no cure for that kind of willed ignorance and lazy uninquisitiveness. Your authentic self can be that you're an authentic arsehole (which is a point I think Matt made in the Maté ep). And finally, yes, totally agree that in the US the far left is outside the DNC protesting against it, whereas the far right is inside the RNC fantasising that the far left is inside the DNC rather than outside it. This is more than a Dude-style "well that's just, like, your opinion, man" point, it should be objectively observable. Not that that's going to stop culture war "centrists" both-siding the situation. Whatevs
Paul Bowman
2024-09-01 08:49:19 +0000 UTCOr - counterpoint - maybe Destiny's just a totally authentic clinical psychopath
Paul Bowman
2024-09-01 08:19:10 +0000 UTCGotcha! I was riffing on his comment not realizing it was specific to an article, and probably thinking of someone I know irl and yelling at them vicariously with my comment ; ) ‘Body with a vagina’ sounds like a bad role as an extra on a crime show or a hipster band (of all dudes, of course)
Monica B.
2024-09-01 06:48:04 +0000 UTCCheers… though it was actually the potentially more objectionable ‘body with a vagina’, that was used in the lancet. Kinda their fault for promoting it on the cover, but not a policy change that meant you could not say woman.
Christopher Kavanagh
2024-09-01 06:23:27 +0000 UTCBe right back. Going to start a band called Pyramid of Idiots. (I hope editor Andy is already working on the graphics for the thumbnail. Who sits atop the pyramid?)
Randy
2024-09-01 02:57:30 +0000 UTCAnd great to have you guys back!
Monica B.
2024-09-01 02:29:49 +0000 UTCLol at Sam seeing the term ‘pregnant person’ as an eRoSioN of InsTituTioNs, and implying it means you can’t say woman anymore. Language shifts. Sam seemingly doesn’t. A full on goofball!
Monica B.
2024-09-01 02:22:55 +0000 UTCOkay, I've got it everyone... regarding the Online/Offline thing, I have invented a phrase that is positively Weinsteinian in its brilliance: "In Tweeto Veritas!" Thank you! Please use it as often as you can. With attribution - don't Robin DiAngelo me. Oh wait, I just Googled the phrase and found that Jesse Singal used it in 2018. :(
Robert Andrews
2024-09-01 02:16:21 +0000 UTCNo
ermias drake
2024-09-01 00:45:23 +0000 UTCI continue to think Chris and Matt are giving Destiny way too much credit, if anything he seems like the perfect example of what Sam is talking about in that his personality has been completely warped and consumed by the internet and the incentive structures of being a twitch streamer and online culture critic. I don't think he's "authentic" at all.
Ryan Goss
2024-08-31 22:30:19 +0000 UTC@Ben Godek - absolutely, sometimes line for line the same. I remember him gently being taken to task by an anti-terrorism expert, telling him how profiling for terrorists by religion doesn't work. He made the same argument afterwards as he made before.
David Noble
2024-08-31 21:29:14 +0000 UTCHahaha. WHY CAN'T I BE PART OF THE TURBO TEAM?!
David Noble
2024-08-31 21:25:36 +0000 UTCI agree Harris thinks he has reached the apex of rationality. That much is clear after he released that 8 minute episode encouragimg listeners to join his meditation app so we too could be as enlightened as he.
Tim Tripp
2024-08-31 17:48:54 +0000 UTCGood on Bad Stats for giving us insight into Peterson Academy.
Linda Sears
2024-08-31 17:41:58 +0000 UTC“Yo Sam. I left a 12 year old twitter account a couple months ago. My life hasn’t changed at all. What were you up to on twitter anyway?”😝😂
Kgar
2024-08-31 17:32:17 +0000 UTCSo funny
Kgar
2024-08-31 17:24:29 +0000 UTCWhat was that? A pyramid of morons kissing each others’ butts? 🤣😂🤣😂 And then ‘like human centipede?’ Still the best listen in my crowded pod list!
Kgar
2024-08-31 17:16:46 +0000 UTC🤣 I love that Sam Harris ranting about social media reminds Matt of I Think You Should Leave Left unchecked, his social media mirror world diatribe eventually ends up at "They replaced your real toilet with a joke toilet that's just for farts!?! Has this ever happened to you!?!"
James P.
2024-08-31 17:01:35 +0000 UTCJust had to google the term midwit
James P.
2024-08-31 16:33:01 +0000 UTCYep absolutely! And that is a polar opposite of being an intellectual. You are supposed to constantly learn, engage with new sources, challenge your priors and fine tune your thinking. Guess Harris is so egotistical and deluded that he believes that he has reached perfect rationality. Everyone else is morally confused, woke, bad faith while he himself is the only one that can see clearly. Harris is an insufferable twit.
SHOUNAK SARKAR
2024-08-31 16:25:05 +0000 UTCAs a former Sam Harris fan, I’m amazed by how identical all of his talking points are to 8 years ago. Once he forms a position, he seems immune to ever changing it.
Ben Godek
2024-08-31 15:51:02 +0000 UTCThanks. Yep, I have seen that email exchange. It was so embarrassing for Harris haha! I say that and I’m not even a fan of Chomsky as such. Harris is a classic reactionary.
SHOUNAK SARKAR
2024-08-31 15:38:55 +0000 UTCI resent the gurus even more than I used to simply because I'm listening to Destiny now and thinking, "He's actually quite sensible and logical to my ears these days." Bastards, all of em.
JustTheWorstEver
2024-08-31 15:24:04 +0000 UTCThey don’t disappoint Linda
Julie
2024-08-31 15:20:25 +0000 UTCWish I could triple-like your comment. So true. Harris has kevlar reinforced blinkers when it comes to certain issues. Have you seen his email exchange with Chomsky on intentions?
trol
2024-08-31 14:58:30 +0000 UTCLooking forward to discovering what craziness our gurus have been up to.
Linda Sears
2024-08-31 13:51:17 +0000 UTCYeah, this is often his move: extreme comments, then defend the weakest interpretation of them or claim he was just venting/joking/being sarcastic, whatever. He is just dishonest and doesn’t care what harm he causes, unless it’s to his own ego.
Intergalactic Panda Wrangler
2024-08-31 13:43:49 +0000 UTCAs much as I dislike Destiny, it’s amazing how much more informed he is on multiple issues (Israel-Palestine, American politics) compared to Sam Harris. He added nuances, brought up Israeli settlements, made the perfect comparison between the relative power of far-left and far-right, but Harris just repeated his standard right wing talking points. What a painfully ignorant, shallow and bloviating guru. Incredible how he has no intellectual curiosity at all and yet filled with so much ego and arrogance. No wonder he’s best friends with Douglas Murray.
SHOUNAK SARKAR
2024-08-31 12:30:18 +0000 UTCAlso, his description of leaving Twitter shows that. No insight into his own behaviour, no reflection, no impulse control, no ability to assess things in real time, no ability to but his experience in proportion. The fact that people go to this guy for both spiritual and intellectual guidance is absurd. He is one of the least mindful, least enlightened people I can imagine 😂 and yeah, if people still don’t think his a bigot at this point I have no idea where to start.
Intergalactic Panda Wrangler
2024-08-31 11:55:46 +0000 UTCIf Destiny actually said that, it’s so reckless and morally reprehensible. Some things are better left unsaid. I despise Trump but Americans need to beat him at the ballot box.
SHOUNAK SARKAR
2024-08-31 11:55:16 +0000 UTCAmen. I see Harris as the quintessential “hysterical man speaking calmly”, as Michael Brooks so accurately described. Harris is a painfully shallow and ignorant guru as well in addition to being a bigot.
SHOUNAK SARKAR
2024-08-31 11:51:37 +0000 UTCGreat to hear from my two favourite guru whisperers again haha! Chris, IMO the only two places which I found to be as beautiful as Switzerland are Indian Himalayas and New Zealand! Highly recommend visiting both places for both of you especially Matt, if u haven’t been already. Btw, now that Kamala clawed back all the down on Biden vote from RFK, he was always going to drop out. I always suspected it was a Trumpist operation to divide Democrats. Did you see the story about him sawing off the head of a dead whale and driving it back home on the top of his car? What an insane guy! Also, “a pyramid of idiots kissing each others butts up the hierarchy” is a superb quote lol! Thanks Matt, great way to describe the online secular guru world.
SHOUNAK SARKAR
2024-08-31 11:50:15 +0000 UTCThe idea that Sam Harris is the ‘opposite’ of JBP’s emotionality literally made me spit out my coffee laughing. He *acts* like he is emotionless, but he is clearly furious, indignant, insecure, and intensely emotionally driven. That’s partly why he can’t change his position even when he is obviously wrong. Occasionally it slips out when he is challenged, he pushes it down but you can see he wants to scream at people. Destiny wouldn’t challenge him on anything at the moment because this month he agrees with Harris on everything. Next month, who knows?!
Intergalactic Panda Wrangler
2024-08-31 11:44:42 +0000 UTC5G. Yeah. 📶
Ketil Parow
2024-08-31 11:23:55 +0000 UTCThis was night of the shooting. As someone who would consider himself a frequent Destiny enjoyer (if not a “fan” just because I can’t stand the sycophancy in streamer communities, his included) this stream stood out to me as particularly gross. Within the next few days he was much clearer that he was just mirroring conservative standards at them to make a point about asymmetry which I think is a post-hoc rationalization but at least it’s an understandable stance.
Andy
2024-08-31 10:33:27 +0000 UTChttps://youtu.be/_8u-jpd1jlo?si=6-dLYPL8CkRQMmzL “If we’re not in America anymore, whatever post-country we’re in, maybe shooting at people is on the table. I dunno” - 12:18 “When you anoint a king, again, the only way to take a king out is what? I mean how are kings traditionally removed from power? What do you expect to happen?” - 19:46 in this video in relation to the recent immunity decision from the Supreme Court Similar “kings can and must be killed to be removed from power” sentiment at 12:39 as well
Andy
2024-08-31 10:30:54 +0000 UTCGot a link to the original tweets/statements?
Christopher Kavanagh
2024-08-31 10:09:24 +0000 UTCI’ve been pointing this out so you may have seen me making this point in the Patreon chat but Destiny initially actually put forth an argument for more assassination attempts against Trump AND his supporters before silently reeling it back a bit into a much more defensible position over the next couple days
Andy
2024-08-31 09:41:53 +0000 UTCGet some feckin' oil! 🤣
Siobhan Murphy
2024-08-31 09:29:41 +0000 UTCMaybe he's naturally stoned.
Roland Weber
2024-08-31 09:08:25 +0000 UTCChris is saying, "lot of sheep, lot of green, lots of cars", has a Trump vibe to it 🤣
Kyle
2024-08-31 08:35:37 +0000 UTCThis is top drawer productivity. I’m going in and expecting at least six fluffs and 2 MATTrixes (TM).
john statham
2024-08-31 08:01:55 +0000 UTCGood episode lads, great to have the SM back. I find Harris and Destiny the absolute worst. Can't stand the pair of them
Tom Wheatley
2024-08-31 07:41:37 +0000 UTCPageau's rant on 5G truly was one for the ages. This tendency to link everything by way of analogy is great for late-night dorm room/ stoner conversation but ffs Pageau is in his 50s and presumably stone-cold sober 😂🤦♂️ It was also really useful hearing Matt describe the measures the authorities took to ward off the black death. In the heart of Christendom, who'd have thought that the powers that be were more than happy to tread on individual sovereignty in the pursuit of the collective good?!
Will
2024-08-31 06:52:39 +0000 UTCIt's been ages lads! 💚💚😊
Siobhan Murphy
2024-08-31 06:41:12 +0000 UTC👏
Lillie
2024-08-31 05:22:32 +0000 UTC🤖
Jake Lawrence
2024-08-31 05:21:43 +0000 UTC
