Next Decoding Source Material: Red Scare Podcast
Added 2023-11-24 08:35:40 +0000 UTCRed Scare was on our to-do list as many people requested we cover them and we like to break up the endless parade of narcissistic middle-aged men.
I do not know if this was the best option for a 'break'.
To provide a spoiler, we do not really think they are secular gurus just annoying people. Like being stuck at some hipster party with a gang of 20-somethings who are too cool for all this lameness (and also happen to be in their 30s).
Anyway, they also manage to get into anti-vax stuff and conspiracy theories because what else would they talk about?
The interview subject Tao Lin is a whole trip on his own.
Anyway, we apologise in advance but good to have occasional non-guru annoying people to remind people that not everyone we dislike is a guru!
Comments
Speaking as a diagnosed autistic, I would just like to say: nothing and avoid eye contact.
Ymirsdreams
2023-12-02 15:10:41 +0000 UTC1 hour 21 minutes But soon after I gave up. They brought me to my knees
mobitobi
2023-12-01 14:09:29 +0000 UTCResponding to an earlier comment re: autism and assholes - while I'm not autistic, I know autistic people who find that whole 'oh he's just autistic' excuse for poor behaviour really annoying. Because the speaker is impliedly saying that autism and being an asshat are the same thing :P From the comments above it sounds like you're both pretty sensitive to the difference between 'being an asshat' and 'knowing intuively how to navigate social situations'... but I always think back with a smile to an autistic friend of mine who saw me cry after my LTR ended. He stood there totally silent for a few minutes, not saying anything, staring at me. Another friend said gently: 'Why don't you give her a hug?'. Poor dude sounded so anxious when he replied: 'Is that the right thing to do???' And then I realised he wasn't indifferent, he just didn't know what the social 'rule' was and he was terrified of hurting me by doing the wrong thing. Weirdly knowing he cared that much about not hurting me was more of a hug than the actual hug :)
Artemis Green
2023-11-30 00:11:56 +0000 UTCYes, it is an interesting question to consider.
Linda Sears
2023-11-29 00:11:33 +0000 UTCI guess this is another example where labels can be useful but they can also be problematic because they fail to account for the many factors that influence how we behave. I appreciate the concept of double empathy because it helps us to see things from both perspectives (neurodivergent and neurotypical). I’ve sometimes wondered if my twin and I are autistic because we have had difficulty relating to others. Yet, this could also have been caused by being in our own “twin world” as children and teens.
Linda Sears
2023-11-28 13:39:22 +0000 UTCSine Johansen. It's funny. I was actually just about to say that I think my ex bf might have been undiagnosed autistic, and my best friend is convinced that her husband is as well. Perhaps we are applying too broad off a brush. But I think in both cases, we didn't ever tell our partner that that was what we thought. We just kept it to ourselves and then when they did something that was particularly weird or socially awkward we silentlly referenced our theory and then we were able to be more patient and tolerant because of it. I feel like that was a fairly good outcome from a pragmatic perspective. Even if it might not be quite right academically. And to be fair, I have late diagnosed adult ADHD. So there was doubtlessly just as many things about me which my ex probably found very weird.
Emma
2023-11-27 03:43:22 +0000 UTCRe: autism and empathy, have a think about what has been called the 'double empathy' problem - I think it adds an interesting nuance to what you're talking about. For example: https://www.crossrivertherapy.com/autism/double-empathy-problem I should note this idea has mostly gained currency in autistic/neurodivergent circles rather than academic ones, but (with all due respect to any psych or psych-adjacent academics who might be reading this comment!) a lot of the academic perspectives on ASD that I read really just don't consider or take seriously the way that autistic people see themselves. Also, autistic people aren't angelic beings or a monolith, it is possible to be both a complete d-bag and an autistic person at the same time :)
Artemis Green
2023-11-27 03:18:21 +0000 UTCResponding to an earlier comment from one of the DTG guys - I'm not autistic but I have ADHD and sensory processing differences, and I have gotten the 'personality quirk' thing so many times. The first time was a week after I was diagnosed... ironically the commenter was the teacher at a week-long yoga teacher education course on how to teach in a way that was inclusive to people with various mental health challenges. I was so peeved I 'came out' publicly for the first time to call her out in class :P I can only imagine my ASD cousins get much the same, but probably worse, because ASD is even more stigmatised and stereotyped than ADHD I'd say. Full disclosure I haven't listened to this podcast and probably won't because it will make me extremely cross for no benefit, so hopefully this comment still speaks to the context.
Artemis Green
2023-11-27 03:10:13 +0000 UTCSine, I think it is quite confusing to parse out which diagnosis best fits. It sounds like you are trying to find ways to cope that work for you, and I’m so happy you have a dog to help you! Nina, I appreciate your explanations of sensory processing disorder. Since I teach students that have ADHD and students with Autism, it helps to understand better what they may be dealing with.
Linda Sears
2023-11-26 23:06:34 +0000 UTCSine Johnson - yes, many many people have both diagnoses to the extent that I suspect there will be a single diagnosis in the future.
Nina Davies
2023-11-26 23:03:32 +0000 UTCSine Johansen- sensory processing disorder is a difficulty processing sensations. This can mean hyper sensitivity or lack of sensitivity to sound, visual information, smell, taste, textures and the bodily sensations that arise in response to emotional experience. This means that people become overwhelmed by sensory experience on the one hand or may not recognise pain or illness on another. The difficulty processing sensory experience leads to disregulation which can be seen behaviourally as stimming (repetitive movements or making noises/ reapeating words) or explosive short temper or apparent 'shut down' or non-responsiveness.
Nina Davies
2023-11-26 19:56:08 +0000 UTCDo you mean 1 minute 21 seconds, or 1 hour 21 minutes?
Roland Weber
2023-11-26 18:52:14 +0000 UTCYay for dogs indeed Linda! Autism is becoming or has become a very common way of talking about certain traits we have (black a white thinking/social misunderstandings etc.) so it really isn't surprising that the meaning escapes a rigid medical description. It happens with mental health diagnosis too ('I'm a bit bi-polar' or saying 'I'm depressed' when being sad). It is how language works so I think we have to forgive misunderstanding to an extent.
Nina Davies
2023-11-26 18:43:29 +0000 UTCNina, I think I might be one of those people who have made that mistake about the Autism spectrum referring to degrees of severity rather than a set of diagnostic criteria. Thank you for sharing your experiences and knowledge.
Linda Sears
2023-11-26 17:44:29 +0000 UTCYay dogs!
Linda Sears
2023-11-26 17:25:56 +0000 UTCExactly! That’s the part that seems so depressing.
Erin Dougherty
2023-11-26 14:39:53 +0000 UTCThat's lovely. I think dogs can be wonderful teachers!
Emma
2023-11-26 13:44:39 +0000 UTCI was using this as a simple example of an everyday struggle really! We have been through much tougher times. She has a puppy now and it is wonderful to see her be annoyed by him but manage the annoyance and still love him. I hope this will happen with humans one day!!
Nina Davies
2023-11-26 13:35:40 +0000 UTCI don't want to be offensive and acknowledge I am not qualified to diagnose anyone. But I think there are 2 things that sometimes get confused. As I understand it autistic people have tonnes of empathy if they know someone else us suffering. But because they struggle to read other people this can sometimes come across as unfeeling. And then there are narcassists who can read other people very well, as evidenced by the fact they are often talented manipulators, but they just don't give a shit about other people. And in my own life I've encountered quite a few examples of people who are complete arseholes, who try to self diagnose and self describe as being 'a bit autistic'. And I wonder if they are noticing in themselves an unusual lack of empathy, and diagnosing themselves as a but autistic is much more self flattering then the alternative explanation for their unusual reaction to other people. Having said that I do think underdiagnosis of autism has been a real problem in the past and I also know several adults who I think possibly are undiagnosed high functioning autistics. But they don't think that about themselves. It is a complicated subject!!
Emma
2023-11-26 13:10:03 +0000 UTC@Nina Davies I am sorry your daughter is going through that. It sounds very hard on her and probably your whole family:-(
Emma
2023-11-26 12:59:48 +0000 UTCYes - almost daily at one time. Understandably there is an interest in the Sherlock Holmes type genius-social-misfits as portrayed by Benedict Cummberbatch. I suspect many people identify with the misunderstood genius. Then there are definitely people who live with perhaps two out of the 3 diagnosis criteria who self-diagnose ( again, understandably). Then there are those that are simply trying to empathise and say they perhaps understand something of what you are talking about by saying 'we are all on the spectrum' (imagining a spectrum of severity rather than a spectrum of diagnostic criteria). Teachers and health professionals that are not psychologists also subscribe to these beliefs because they do not observe at daily the challenges that autistic people (and their families) have to manage. After all, what is the difference between a teenager refusing to tidy their room and an autistic teenager in catatonic burnout to the casual onlooker?
Nina Davies
2023-11-26 11:26:41 +0000 UTCNina, have you come across people like this elsewhere? Treating it like a kooky personality quirk?
Christopher Kavanagh
2023-11-26 10:59:48 +0000 UTCMy husband and 3 adult children are autistic (diagnosed) so I am 4x an expert. The thing they all miss in the discussion is sensory processing disorder as necessary for diagnosis. It is exhausting and very difficult to manage (as it includes difficulty processing emotion so can be extremely risky during adolescence). My 16 year old would love friends but everyone annoys her so much ( which she can't process easily) she constantly makes decisions to be alone which impacts her social anxiety mental health massively. It is very strange listening to people who have no idea talk endlessly about something they believe they know something about. Perhaps I should do a podcast on car maintenance or macro economics.
Nina Davies
2023-11-26 10:56:45 +0000 UTCBut I actually think they are grown ups. They're not as young as they think they are passing as!
Emma
2023-11-26 04:02:46 +0000 UTCThis has me thinking of a recent Conspirituality episode where the guest posits that the next counterculture movement will be right wing. (I think she’s right). These women are irony poison personified, reminding me of myself as a cynical teenager. Saying that nothing can turn you into a conservative like making lots of money feels like they’re being self aware/ironic (this idea is one we heard our parents say) and also completely genuine because they’re so vapid and never apparently had any moral compass to begin with. Being a hot, young, vocal fry heavy contrarian who just can’t muster the energy to give a fuck is pretty lame and I’m glad I don’t know any grown ups like this. To live every day wallowing in your own irony soup is so depressing and they do seem depressed. Fuck em. (Note that I think critiques of vocal fry and the use of “like” are often sexist/classist, but in this case it seems to be exaggerated intentionally to make a point… a really stupid point)
Erin Dougherty
2023-11-25 19:19:50 +0000 UTCYou sneaky devils. In truth since most of us didn’t make it that far, you are doing us a public service by listening closely to the whole thing, editing out the particularly alarming parts, and cogently addressing them. So, I think it balances out.
Linda Sears
2023-11-25 14:35:04 +0000 UTCI used to listen (half heartedly) in the past but often zoned out..it’s very much vibe heavy low content. This time I paid attention I think for about 20 mins and the guest is even worse than the usual conversation, but mainly cos the topic is actually something fairly serious and worth thinking properly about.
Diane Morrison
2023-11-25 08:20:56 +0000 UTCOh I forgot about the testosterone and autism loop but they brought it up again
Margaret Drennan
2023-11-25 01:54:50 +0000 UTCWhat is happening. Glyphosate replaced DDT. Glyphosate is in the vaccines. There will be neurotypical overloads safeguarding a society of nonspeaking autistics. The fish oil is rancid. No, it's not rancid. No, it is rancid. Eat organ meat. Eat McDonalds.
Margaret Drennan
2023-11-25 01:50:22 +0000 UTCNext week
Christopher Kavanagh
2023-11-24 23:19:25 +0000 UTCIt’s actually a clever marketing campaign to make you appreciate us more.
Christopher Kavanagh
2023-11-24 23:19:10 +0000 UTCIt’s so fucking awful. It’s Scott Adams levels of irritating. I can’t finish it.
Riku
2023-11-24 22:32:23 +0000 UTCI didn’t count the seconds so not sure how I rate on the scale of how long I could stand listening but it was not long after I heard the first vocal fry.
Rod Hodges
2023-11-24 18:24:33 +0000 UTCTheir guest episodes are largely even worse than their regular episodes, something most of their listeners agree on.
Subodh Kafle
2023-11-24 16:46:18 +0000 UTCBlimey, life is far too short for this garbage, one too many space cakes and an excess of middle class emptiness- I too will wait for decoding!
Neil Howarth
2023-11-24 16:21:29 +0000 UTCI made it to 1:21 and feel like this month Chris and Matt need to pay reparations to their patreons for emotional damages.
mobitobi
2023-11-24 15:38:23 +0000 UTCYes, I had many questions as well. What may seem like more young people being autistic now could be them dealing with post-Covid isolation and lack of socialization as well as being online and getting their social interaction that way. At least that has been my experience teaching at an open enrollment community college where almost all my students are on their phones, tablets, or computers during my class. That is not counting the sleeping ones 😢. We do have students on the spectrum as well. Some of them have been my more engaged students.
Linda Sears
2023-11-24 14:32:48 +0000 UTCI got through about 20 or so minutes. I’ll be the bad student and say I did my homework. I’ll wait for the decoding.
Linda Sears
2023-11-24 14:26:14 +0000 UTCThe music was more annoying to me, but I was old already when this was the thing.
Linda Sears
2023-11-24 14:07:36 +0000 UTCWhen should we expect this? Curious to see quite how annoying you find them haha...
Oliver Bostridge
2023-11-24 13:30:18 +0000 UTCWhat really hurts about this one (for me) is they made an extremely low budget horror movie a couple of years ago that I loved. Now it's sinking in that they are actually the people I assumed that film was mocking. Yikes.
Allan Malcolm McPherson
2023-11-24 12:05:33 +0000 UTCSoo, I have many questions..are they faking "autistic speech" for fun? Is a non-medical, self-diagnosed autistic person an expert in the area? Is them using the r-word a stance they take, or are they ignorant? Are any of the stats that this guy gives actually factual? Anyone else getting big bully vibes from the women, like they're mocking the guy and he's not getting it? Excruciating listening experience! Threw in the towel at 20mins
Lee Kebum
2023-11-24 11:42:49 +0000 UTCCan we have a self-help circle going for everyone who listened to more than 10 minutes of the source material? I am 15 min in and in dire need of help
mobitobi
2023-11-24 11:31:39 +0000 UTCThis is every conversation at the bar I used to own.
Allan Malcolm McPherson
2023-11-24 11:29:25 +0000 UTCOk I spoke too soon. I see now being deliberately as offensive as possible is like their kink or something.
Emma
2023-11-24 10:10:42 +0000 UTCAgree! Was all downhill from there.
Emma
2023-11-24 09:50:41 +0000 UTCDisclaimer: I couldn't listen to this shit for more than 3 mins at a time without questioning my life choices
Riku
2023-11-24 09:49:35 +0000 UTCThe intro music was a throwback and the best part of the podcast
Riku
2023-11-24 09:47:56 +0000 UTCArgh. Their voices are so annoying. And the woke side of me is getting quite offended! I mean he may well be autistic. But just self diagnosing yourself doesn't make you an expert and certainly doesn't mean you can call other autistic people r****! According to ancestory.com I am 4% maori but I can't go up to a black person and use the n word and them try and claim its ok cause I'm an insider.
Emma
2023-11-24 09:38:23 +0000 UTCYou guys are the best
Michael
2023-11-24 09:08:09 +0000 UTC
