Attack on Titan 4x15 Reaction Extended (YT link below)

Something I love which seems super consistent in this show is that the villains are always those who, one way or another, want "humanity" (i.,e. the walldians) to die out for some reason or another. It emphasizes the whole "suvival" theme even further. And regardless of how that conclusion is reached or how faux noble it seems on the surface, the end result is always the same and its always justified by some feeble excuse or way of thinking. The Titans "wanted" the Eldians to all die because their purpose was to eat them. The Marleyans and other nations want the Eldians to die out of hatred. Reiner wanted them to die to save his own family and give purpose to his mission. The royal family and Zeke want the Eldians to die to atone for their sins and achieve peace from conflict. But no matter how seemingly "glorious" the cause, at it's heart you can see that all of these plans are evil for how they try to steal the Eldians agency from them and sentence them to death. Speak for yourself, as you said, is pretty much the answer that the scouts and the rest of the Walldians give. Meanwhile, every character who is truly heroic in this show has a strong desire to live, which despite sometimes questionable methods, is a way more bright and optimistic idea to get behind. However, as s4 demonstrates, the lines of "hero" start to get blurred when characters like Hange and Eren begin employing the same tactics as the enemy for their freedom, namely hiding the truth and deciding what's best for others without their input.

Jordan Runner

Something interesting to note. In this episode we see Grisha repeatedly use the phrase "you're our son" or "you're my son" to imply that, unlike his future second wife would say, Zeke is special *specifically because* he is his and Dina's son, and not because he is his own person. This way of thinking not only strips Zeke from developing his own identity, but also totally encapsulates Grisha forcing his own desires onto Zeke to carry out. Later on, when Eren is born, we see that he never had to grow up with any of that burden, because Carla's philosophy was nearly the opposite: my son is special simply because he was born, because he is his own person. During his time in the walls, we see that Grisha seems to have learned from his past sins and raises Eren differently than Zeke, never trying to reveal or force his mission onto Eren and instead letting his curiosity towards the world develop naturally. However, after the walls are attacked and his wife dies, right before taking Eren into the forest, Grisha tells Shades: "this boy is not like you, he's my son." Faced with the trauma of losing his wife and another attack inflicted by Marley, it's almost like he reverts back to his old self, which is what makes him force his mission onto Eren just like he did with Zeke.

Jordan Runner

Also really loved the speech at the end regarding the cynical viewpoint of "the world is cruel, there is no point to others lives just as there is no point to my own"

Nick

Only am I just now realizing how mirrored Zeke and Erwin's upbringings are. Zeke sold his parents out to the government, Erwin fought for justice for his father after the government killed him. Adds a different layer to the boulder toss charge in Season 3 where Zeke killed Erwin.

Nick

I just remembered the first episode is titled "To you in 2000 years"

Nick

You should definitely react to Monster sometime after this.

aaron

Great point. I didn't even think about that!

Yusuf

wow I just read a book about that

hec

It’s funny for me how Eren’s face wasn’t the same in the manga when he was telling Zeke: “I’ll put an end for this 2000 years story” or smth like that. In manga he seemed far more determined about those words

Dorney_Sunraint

someone may have mentioned this before but if not this is a cool thing to think about. eren was the child grisha wanted in marley and zeke was the child grisha wanted in paradis. despite how awful grisha was towards zeke it is *nice* that he acknowledges it in 3x20/21 and that we saw how he changed his actions for the better in his parenting with eren (not that it helped too much lol)

armando

Truly the best side

Alex G

Thanks! I'm glad haha

Alex G

You make a compelling case :D

Alex G

yeah, it's pretty disturbing

Shawn

Just to add on why this current beast might have been useless. Remember in ep2, Colt mentions that there hasn't been a beast titan like Zeke's in a long time or in it's history. This will be due to his royal blood which no one else knew about.

Nyashaxo

I think this was the weekend with the two episodes and I was definitely sobbing after each of them lol

Ashley A.

I mean... the person advocating for genocide is objectively wrong.

Don Morrison

Also, Eren's whole thing is that he was born into this world. Whenever he has started to despair or given up on life, he is brought back to the fact that he deserves a good life simply because he was born. For Zeke's true mission to be what it is, how can Eren agree with that? Every time I think about this show, I wonder what is going through Eren's mind. *Will finish this video later lol*

Ashley A.

*I have to pause this video and clock back in for work but wanted to comment first lol* One thing about Zeke that has made me question how "loyal" Eren is to Zeke has to do with the fact that Zeke is assuming Grisha treated Eren the same way. He's assuming Grisha forced his views onto Eren the way he did to Zeke. The only real thing Eren got was a dying wish. He wasn't raised to hate the world and with this responsibility to save it. Eren has just always wanted to be free.

Ashley A.

cute doggo :DD

minimonie__

Alot of fans are self proclaimed Jeagerists who cheer at Eren because "he does what needs to be done". Marley and the redt of the world can just die because they are the ones attacking them. They even view the other scouts as traitors for not following Eren.

ArmdVctr

humm. It is an interest thought... I don't believe the "child he wanted in Paradise" part... I don't think Grisha wanted something specific when he was there, he just tried to fix the mistakes of the part, the mistakes in how he raised Zeke. What is really interesting to me is that, in paradise, being a good father, he raised Eren. And then I think: What if Eren was Grisha's first son, raised in Marley by a revolutionary, crazy demanding parent? Would he still be the Eren we knew during season one? or would he ended up being another Zeke?

I don't care about AoT anymore... I only care about doggo in the river.

dogy!

Captain Thistle

Throwback to when i first saw your reaction to aot on youtube episode 1 while FMAB reactions were still airing, i knew i had to get patreon for more content faster and i really dont regret that decision because i learnt a lot from your insights, keep it up !

Nicolas Sabado

From 1927 to 1940, 60,000 Americans were forcefully euthanized in order to stop "negative traits" from being passed down. These were people with OCD, Autism, Schizophrenia, Bipolar disorder, depression, and even ADHD. Their choice to have a family was taken away from them. It's easy to consider talking points in an anime as hypothetical, but eugenics and genocide are very real and have occurred many times in human history. Please research this and ask yourself whether or not it is the "best last plan."

Makima

Might I suggest jujutsu kaisen for the next show? It’s very new and pretty awesome! There’s only one season so far (24/25 episodes) so it would be a manageable amount too.

Anna Lena Ciplajevs

YOOO I READ THAT BOOK truly an inspirational read.

Nick Deano

It’s kind of ironic how the son Grisha raised solely as a pawn for his mission turned against him and shattered basically everything he worked for, and the son he raised with love and support as his own person gained a similar set of ideals to his old self.

QuillerKeen

I feel like Zeke’s “euthanization/sterilization” plan is the best “last plan”, like if you don’t have any other options left. That’s just my opinion

Jabez Katsak

Thank you! Marley ruthlessly uses Titans and keeps Eldians in internment camps. Absolute hypocrites. They don't even destroy Titans, they just create more and more.

Yusuf

When you started talking about 'don't take my word for it, there are people who suffered and came away with the meaning', I immediately thought of the author who suffered in concentration camps. Then you actually mentioned him! So cool! I like his take on suffering, that suffering is suffering, it doesn't matter how bad you have it, it fills you up like gas. People's depths of hatred are astounding. I come from Pakistan, there is a minority group that lives on the borders of Afghanistan so they live both in Pakistan and Afghanistan. They are targeted for the killing because they are Shia (a sect in Islam). Men, women, and children, all massacred every now and then. They stand out because they have unique Asian-like features. So they are literally targeted based on looks. They are called Hazara ethnic Shias. Sometimes they are blown up and sometimes hit and run. One of their city's entrances is basically a grave.

Yusuf

Their hatred for the Eldians really is something else... When it comes to the war and what the right course of action is, I think the devil is in the details. Hatred itself is to me, not a justification for fighting since it is just an emotion. Being attacked certainly does justify fighting, but I think not all fighting is created equal. It's difficult to say where that line is but I think where it isn't is the idea "this country or group means me harm, now EVERYTHING is acceptable in the name of stopping the threat, including harming those who pose no direct threat and are limited to their own hatred."

Alex G

Thanks for the recommendation :) I actually have never reacted to a trailer but it does seem like fun and not as involved as a full episode

Alex G

Haha yeah it's an endless struggle. There's no right answer. Maybe it works best as just the rhetorical question that it is. I think the underlying humility and also resistance to oppression that it contains makes it work as a mantra of sorts.

Alex G

I saw a quote once that made tons of sense, it was something like "Zeke was the child Grisha wanted in Paradise, whilst Eren was the child he wanted in Marley".

SirLagginton

Man that was beautiful.

Alex G

I didn't know the name before but I've heard it and I've even believed it myself. I once had a conversation with my mom where she said that's something she worried about before she had me, and it was nice to have had the opportunity to talk about how grateful I am for my own life

Alex G

also idk if u noticed a couple eps ago (the one where the ass chair exploded) but the animation and such was lack luster it was for THIS episode specifically from when Zeke pulls on the thunder spear: the individual rain drops, the slow motion just MMM SO GOOD

Brimmy

I'm so glad to hear that his limbs are intact lmao

Alex G

I think that the level of danger doesn't change my feelings about choice, it just makes the choices harder. And that's part of what makes characters that can rise above these challenges heroic and desirable. To say a character is a villain is not necessarily to hate them or to not sympathize with them or to wish harm to befall them. To me it's more like, villains are the characters that when faced with these difficult circumstances make the wrong choices which often involve some kind of arrogance, judgement, deep hatred or anger, etc, as well as a focus on RESULTS over doing the right thing or at least not doing the wrong thing. In regards to that circumstance based thinking, there are a handful of issues with thinking that the ends justify the means. First, life is definitely not linear in our understanding of cause to effect, and so things ALWAYS go differently than we believe they will or AT LEAST have major ripple effects that can be completely unknown to us. Second, I think it's worth considering something similar to the golden rule of "do unto others," in the form of "if everyone followed the same world view I follow, would that make the world better or worse?" And to me seeing others as expendable means that you yourself are expendable, and that is just not a world view that holds water collectively, where as "do not use people as tools for your own benefit" holds up much better. Often in these deliberations, the total consequences of an action are ignored in favor of the immediate result. And that makes sense since we are wired for our own survival. But our own survival is not all that matters, and even if it is, we survive better if the world is more conducive to survival overall. So to me there's a lot more to consider, and I would wager a lot that doing things more in accordance with the big picture is very closely aligned with what we intuitively feel is heroic. Back to the show, Eren can win, Zeke can bring peace to certain groups at a certain time etc, but their methodologies are not acceptable because they cannot be widely practiced if anyone hopes for a world where people can live peacefully. And it seems likely to me, and I think the show is expressing, the idea that the effects of their attempts to achieve a goal will create situations that are just as bad as not worse than they already are.

Alex G

HERE WE GO ZEKE BACKSTORY THAT'S MADE ME BE LIKE "I DON'T KNOW WHOSE WRONG OR RIGHT ANYMORE SO I'LL JUST BE HERE REGARDLESS OF WHAT HAPPENS"

Brimmy

Perfect timing for that quote. I've been thinking about Avatar so much in connection with the ideas of this show. There's so much thematic overlap, which I guess makes sense given the scope of that they both explore :) Those poor horses!

Alex G

My dad's dog, yeah :)

Alex G

Finally! Apologies for the long Comment but I just want to say as an anime only watcher. I think Eren is playing Zeke; If we remember the episode tittle "Bystander" in Season 3. The Famous words of eren's mother that he carried into battle against the warriors "I think eren is special already. For no other reason than he was born into this world" 100% Eren is not on board with this sterilization plan. Second this episode continues to bring a question to the for front of my mind every time i watch it and that is "Can the nation of marley co-exist as is with a free eldian empire?" It hurts me to say it but I can't put it into words the depth of their hatred other than calling it evil with how the Marlyians feel about the eldians. We saw the janitors reaction at the beginning and then Tom's Ksavers wife rather have died than live with the fact she had sex with an eldian and gave birth to an eldian son. To top it off she killed her own son!! How are you supposed to fight such hate? It's hard to blame random citizens beliefs because they live in a Military dictatorship it seems or something akin to it. Ideally in a democracy or republic its own citizens would vote out these people that don't represent their own interest but that's impossible obviously. which makes me sympathize with the start of this season even more because essentially Eren and the eldians on paradise are fighting against a nation that has this depth of hatred for them that its own citizens can't fight against as well. So with enough beating around the bush I suppose I keep coming back to just self defense and offensive aggression against these people. One could argue that during the 100 years the eldians on paradise didn't attack any one the fact Marley was continuing to send titans too them and attack them was a declaration of war in itself. The Government of Marley built as is I really don't see possible peace unless they were forcefully brought to the table to negotiate peace talks.

John Carrizales

Idk if you've heard about Chainsaw Man, but it's a Manga that has absurd levels of hype. The trailer for the anime just came out and I think it would make for a good little reaction

Amit

i feel like you absolutely nailed it in your analysis of this episode. one thing i wonder about though is the answer to erwins question of "who gets to decide". can that answer be nobody besides you yourself? ideally yes, but i think the answer to that is no because it's impractical, especially in the complex context of nations. there needs to be some sort of authority but unless that authority is elected unanimously it's not representative of everyone's best interests. if zekes euthanasia idea wins 51% of a vote, it's still not fair to impose that on the 49% who dissent, and it's equally unfair even if that margin is 99.9% to 0.1%. subjecting someone to the ideology of a group just bc it's larger isn't really justifiable imo. however, unfortunately for the people of eldia their race and inherent connection to the paths and the founder automatically signs them into a social contract which puts them at the mercy of the founder. so in the context of the show i think erwins question is unanswerable in an objective sense. i can't figure out any right answer to it and perhaps that's the point, but if i had to pick between pure individual autonomy (and the ensuing war/chaos) or some dude (or another centralized force) deciding to euthanize an entire population i'll definitely take the former lol.

joe martin

This episode makes me think of a short flashback in the episode "The Basement:" Eren asks his father when he'll show him the basement, and Grisha replies "Maybe when you learn the most important thing of all." He doesn't tell what that thing is, and I'm hoping the show goes back to just what it was that Grisha was hoping Eren learned. My thought is that this episode probably holds the answer — I think it has to do with what Grisha learned from the failings of his life pre-Shiganhina. Grisha's big mistake during his life in Marley was that he never appreciated what he had, the potential for life even inside Liberio's gates. In the opening shot, he tries to instill this hatred in Zeke of their position in life, comparing their hometown to a birdcage. Meanwhile, we see an absolutely stunning shot of the skyline. Later, Grisha hunches over his work and makes his son study probably-fabricated Eldian history while Zeke stares out the window at another father and son playing baseball, just enjoying the beautiful day. It's not that there isnt't any hatred for Eldians or that the world isn't governed by fear of the Titans, but Grisha has allowed his trauma to consume him to where he is only able to see that darkness. Given his limited view, he "doesnt have a choice" but to go down his path. And so this man blinded his rage against the world tries to train his son to see things in the same way. But we know that Grisha didn't raise Eren the same way as he did Zeke. He very intentionally shielded him from the true extent of the world's cruelty, refusing to let him into the basement. Even when Eren said he wanted to go outside the walls, Grisha neither told him that he should do that or dissuaded him from his ambitions. He just asked the kid why he felt that way. Up until the moment of his death, at which point he does ultimately give Eren his Titan and accompanying mission (Why? What changed? One of AOT's mysteries). But up until that point, it seemed that Grisha had learned from and regretted the way he approached the world with Zeke. Like Kruger said, Grisha could have chosen to venture outside the gates, or he and Faye could have stayed in the wall and grown up together, had their own families. Dina and Grisha could have started a legit social dance club, brought Zeke with them, and made merry with the Liberio community. Eren can fight outside of the wall, but he also has the choice to live peacefully within the wall with Armin and Mikasa. Irrespective of the length, there is an alternative path where rather than pursuing rage and vengeance, Eren and Grisha live fruitful, full lives with the people they care about. That's what I think Grisha's "most important thing of all" was. Even before the walls were attacked, Eren had come to the conclusion all on his own that his world was a cage that needs to be smashed open so he can achieve freedom. But I think what Grisha hoped for his son was that he would realize that inside the walls or out, he's *been free since he was born.* But now, Eren is tearing apart his closest friendships, he's throwing his home into near-civil war, he's escalating the Titan issue to a point where confrontation is unavoidable, all in the name of "freedom." Whatever Eren wants to do, I think its quite possible that by the time he succeeds, he will have nothing left. And what makes this episode imo one of AOT's most fantastic episodes is how wonderfully it shows this, juxtaposing through visuals and soundtrack the beauty of the world they inhabit with a father and son who are unable to see it.

a. tree

The scary thing is Zeke's philosoohy is something that people in the real world hold. It's called anti-natalism. Their philosophy is that it is immoral to bring children in this world filled with suffering without consent.

ArmdVctr

This didn't bother me as opposed to the plot holes and story beats later on but i can still appreciate the world and story he's crafted. Weird take on the gf/drug comment tho.

Hack

Levi getting caught in his own trap is one of the most unforgivably stupid scenes in the history of all anime. I basically pretended to be into AoT after the rest of the world was introduced and it became a completely different and inferior show, but this is the moment I gave up completely, "What's the best trap to set for my opponent? Oh I know, a trap with which he can instantaneously kill me whenever he chooses! Viola!" WTF?! I swear Isayama gave up on this story a long time ago.

Norrin Radd

Always a winner!

Alex G

Yeah it is very hard to believe that Eren would be doing this because he sympathizes with Zeke's plan or cares about his family bonds with him...

Alex G

1) before i watched this episode i had always wondered why zeke, since he knew he was the last royal eldian on the mainland, didn’t father AT LEAST one kid to ensure the power of his bloodline didn’t die out. and then i learned his philosophy on life and i was like oh :| i get it now :| 2) not a manga reader, but i have a hard time believing that eren ‘because i was born into this world’ jaeger would be on board with zeke’s ‘birth is a curse and existence is a prison’ euthanasia ideology. i think eren is lying to zeke and wants to manipulate him for his own purposes. 3) i think its so funny that everyone sees levi get blown up at point-blank range by a thunder spear and after the initial shock they’re like ‘he’ll be fine lmfao just walk it off’. like he's gonna be ok, i know it, it makes no sense to kill him off here and it would probably take more than that to kill him, but even so my friend made me stop the episode and click through the explosion frame by frame to count all his limbs and make sure they're still attached (they are)

bryn sutton

At least he's warm in the winter

Alex G

The one positive is that I'll get to watch it in real time :D

Alex G

I'm pretty sure the voice actor for Uraraka and Gabi are the same too which is so weird.

meg

The GOAT of AOT, for now at least.

benj

man the view of Zeke being a villain really is controversial LOL. I am on the side that the characters in this show have had to resort to some form of cruelty in order to reach a better way of life. Again, who is to say that Eldia didn't rape and pillage all other territories? Would it not then be somewhat justified that the only race capable of becoming a titan is hated? You've also talked about how there is always a choice, and saying you are forced to do something is lazy. In 99% of modern circumstances, yes/maybe. In the circumstances of the show, I dont think so. If you had the knowledge as a Paradisian that the island was being hunted by the world, would you not want to defend it? If you were a Marleyan and told the ability for millions of titans 60m tall were now able to be unleashed by an unhinged teenager, would you not fear for your life? Yes there are always "options" but how feasible are those options and how many variables need to align for them to be successful.

Christian Medeiros

Forced mass sterilization...

DrowsyCody

In the words of Iroh in LOK, "If you look for the light, that you can often find it. But if you look for the dark, that is all you will ever see." Literally that's how the brain works, negative thinking trains your brain to continue negative thinking. I was like that, and I had to actually work to retrain my brain and see the positive. My life has actually improved because of it! I know the world is cruel, and perhaps there's no meaning to any of it, but that's not ALL there is to it. I can still choose to make my life worth it, for myself and for the people I love. Life is beautiful too, when you think about it. What's someone else to decide for me that it's not? Then think they're some hero for it? That's ridiculous. Sympathy for child-Zeke for sure, but his plan is not it. Glad you see it that way too. So I don't believe Eren is on the same page as Zeke. It just doesn't add up for me. No idea what his exact plan is, but it's definitely not preventing Eldians from bearing children. Like first of all, that's taking away their freedoms which is a huge no-no in Eren's book, and second, everyone is born special, according to his mother. Meanwhile Zeke doesn't care who he kills. Eldians, Marleyans, horses.

Kotryna

Is that your dog?

Purple Dawn

Also I'm pretty sure that not all Beast Titans look like Zeke's. I've read somewhere that all the animals that were shown in season 2 opening were previous Beast Titans. So without that pitching skill I doubt they would cause as much damage either.

meg

Nobody: ... Alex: Erwin Smith! Hahah he really was amazing though!

JDalsing

zekes ultimate (totally heroic) plan any morally sound human would totally and definitely sympathize with: eugenics

Mads C

It is my opinion that based on what we know about Eren, he probably does not buy into Zeke's idea — while Zeke's whole thing seems to be "this world is wrong, so it wasn't meant for us and we shouldn't live in it;" Eren's driving belief has consistently been the opposite: "this world is wrong, so I must change it to be right by destroying everything that I feel challenges my birthright." In this way Eren and Zeke represent to me diametrically opposed answers to a central ideological question of this show, so it doesn't super make sense to me that Eren would do a complete 180no matter what happened within those 4 years. We don't know a lot about what brought Eren to the point that he is though so this is just speculation, but I feel like what was actually going on in that scene was Eren using Zeke as a means to an end, the "key to a lock" in a way. And while Zeke is one of the only characters I totally despise, it was heartbreaking to see him tear up when Eren (probably intentionally) called him his brother. All he'd wanted was somebody to call family, but every one of them tried to use or manipulate him into acting as their vessel for revenge against the world, so it's a really sad dramatic irony to see his face light up while we know Eren and know that it's probably happening again. Especially because it seems like a lot of what pushed Zeke to believing that life as an Eldian was just suffering and not worth living was that his family projected their hatred of their lives onto Zeke rather than support him and try to live the most meaningful or happy lives possible with him. Regarding your question about what happens now that Zeke blew himself up, the way I see it it's possible that Zeke survived due to his Titan regeneration but killed Levi, or that Levi survived due to being slightly further from the Thunder Spear itself, but Zeke died due to it being directly inside of him, or we can mix and match. But if Zeke is dead, then there's only one person left in the world who has Eldian royal blood. She's currently on a farm somewhere.

a. tree

Marley would be war mongers with or without the titan power. The irony of them condemning Eldia for past sins when they are committing the same war crimes in the present. The true enemy is human weaknesses and giving into impulses like you said. Life is hard. But when you really look at it, it all stems from human behavior. Greed and all that jazz. If we took care of each other .. life wouldn't be so bad. Unfortunately, most of us can't learn without pain; builds character right? It's a lack of compassion and empathy for others.

Lysieblu

Zeke's ability to control and turn Eldians into Titans isn't the Beast Titan's ability, it's unique to him because of his royal blood. He's like a mini Founding Titan. They mention this earlier on in the season. The Beast Titan is honestly kind of ass on it's own lol.

Polygon

Soo since there is so much negativity about Zeke's euthanization (historically loaded word btw) plan, one positive thing: The plan doesn't involve actually slaughtering a whole race. According to the plan, they would just lose the ability to reproduce and peacefully die out. The plan is still insanely bad, but this peaceful aspect to it is definitely a plus point compared to what others in this show have in mind for Eldia And well, now suddenly all of Zeke's actions, his inner monologue in S3P2 and how he justifies it over all those seasons make sense :)

DennisAnimeFan

Zeke has really been used as a means to an end his whole life. First his Dad tried to, then Marley used them and now (it looks like to me) that Eren is really manipulating him with his "Let's do it, brother" talk to give himself the power to do "something". Knowing Eren he probably secretly hates Zeke and will never honestly call him "brother".

DennisAnimeFan

Haha you almost had me there for a moment when you "ended" the video early

DennisAnimeFan

unfortunately we have to wait 6 months for see the final :(( i cannot wait for the see final of the show

Kahv

I feel like that gives way too many "evil" people a pass tho. Who doesn't think that what they're doing will benefit either themselves or their constituents in *some* positive way? I mean this in the best way. You might just be a biiit naive :)

MikeWest

You say you miss a lot of the details, but honestly I think you've been keeping up really well and your analysis of characters, even all the way back in season 2 and 3, has always impressed me because it lined up so well with their future development. I guess that's good writing for you; it's all there if you look hard enough. I'm with you though, Zeke is no doubt a villain. "Everyone is the hero of their own story," but that doesn't qualify them to write the stories of other people.

Steve.

It’s refreshing to see your reaction. I’ve seen other reactions and it makes me a bit sick to see how people take these things at face value; like Gabby, or Eren. When I see other reactors celebrating when Gabby gets beat up, or anything like that, part of me wants to comment something to the effect of she is just like Eren, but you sympathize with him because we’ve followed him throughout the show. Gabby has gone through similar things and yet you really hate her. I don’t comment in the end because I know I’ll be dismissed by others or be told that its just a show. Maybe it is and in real life people would act differently, but maybe not. I agree that its easy to sympathize, but people should separate that from the actions and their consequences.

Alexander Juárez

Just to keep in mind for the future, it’s briefly mentioned in episode 3 of season 4. Zeke’s ability to turn people into titans is something unique to HIM not the beast titan. The beast titans before zeke did not have these abilities.

DJ Cargill

>This episode does not change my opinion on Zeke in the slightes This show was clearly not written for you > they don't get to enforce it on everybody else for the greater good History will tell you that's how it has always been few make the decision for the rest Otherwise you will get retardation like Anti-Vaxers

PS

Fun fact: Tom Ksaver actually knew Grisha and his family. In S3 E19 when Grisha and Faye are chasing after the blimp they actually bump into Tom on the way out of Liberio. He's also present in S3 E20 alongside his grandparents when it's first mentioned that Zeke turned his parents in. This probably made it that much harder for Tom to suggest Zeke turn his parents in.

Polygon

Maybe I'm a bit naive but I've always thought that true evil is inherent only to people who know what they're doing is morally and ethically wrong but still go through with it. Zeke genuinely thinks he is saving the rest of the world and his people by slowly exterminating them. Yes, it's very fucked up and morally reprehensible, of course. But I think the main reason why many people are hesitant to call him straight up evil or a villain in the conventional sense is that he himself doesn't know that what he's doing is, in fact, not a gift to the world and his people but rather just adds to the pain and suffering and cruelty that he tries to save everyone from.

Sal Inger

I mean, the fact that we have a concept of suffering implies that life is, in its default state, not suffering. Checkmate Yeagerist commenters... I hereby forbid you to be sad, based on wordplay.

MikeWest

or change their brain chemistry so that they're always happy and never feel suffering? lol

Lulu

A Q&A first, then I'm thinking Invincible (8 episodes) and simultaneously opening a poll for the next show, since I really don't have any strong inclinations about what to watch like I did the last few times. But I'm not 100% on it.

Alex G

damn i forgot young Zeke is voiced by Deku. Makes him even more sympathetic for me.

NitrousOxide19

Wait so if the founding titan can control the bodies of Eldians can't they just change their biology so that they can't turn into titans?

Lulu

Wow, we're almost caught up! That "I don't want this to end" sums up a lot of feelings when the end of a series or season starts to draw near. I honestly wasn't sure how the reaction was going to be to Season 4 because it honestly IS quite dark and cynical at times, but it's sparked a lot of great conversation! I don't know if anyone is ready for it to end, but look forward to the current finale!

Aura Y

This episode does not change my opinion on Zeke in the slightest, fuck that guy. Amazing episode though, nonetheless. The Eren/Zeke supporters sure get a lot of content in this season that appears to support their point of view but you like many others in this community are able to see through that. Whatever their plan is, they don't get to enforce it on everybody else for the greater good. Nobody has that right, as Erwin said "Who get's to decide?". I also doubt Mr. Rock Pitcher and Eren "Do you deserve to breath" Jaeger cracked the code on how to solve this global catastrophic war.

benj

Now you see where Eren gets his “charm” from hahaha

hays collins

Just a bit more and you’ll be waiting for more like all of us hahaha

hays collins

Here’s the episode that made me a fan of Zeke’s character (not supporting or excusing his actions ofc but just throwing it out there). It’s no wonder he’s so apathetic towards innocent people, the one person in his life who gave him unconditional love and affection was enforced the belief that it’d better for everyone if they’d never been born. The one person he respected and considered a parent put the idea in his head. Couple that with Grisha, Dina, and Ksaver telling him how special he is and how he has an obligation to change the world really puts Zeke’s mindset into perspective. One of those "oh that's why you're like that" moments.

Kit

Do you already know what's replacing AoT after you catch up next episode?

Jules

hi :)

Alex G

hi

Aray YIKAMACI