Japanese Phonetics Episode 77—Pitch accent in honorifics
Added 2020-05-14 01:38:26 +0000 UTCBibliography
Japanese Phonetics Index Page
December 2022 Update: When updating this lesson with high-quality native recordings, in the section covering the third rule in this lesson (two mora atamadaka words preceded by the honorific お usually maintain their accent), we replaced the examples used to illustrate the exception. This originally used お針が and お鍋が, but お針 is rarely used anymore, and in common usage お鍋 usually follows rule #3 and not the exception. The new examples of お声が and お宿が are more common and fit this exception better.
Two other minor updates include changing お楽しみに to お楽しみが to match the other examples in the section and fixing an incorrect kanji in the title of the 新明解日本語アクセント辞典第二版 (the previous video showed it as 第二番).
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Good afternoon Patrons! The seventy-seventh episode of Japanese Phonetics is now updated with high-quality native recordings! In this lesson we begin to look at pitch-accent in honorifics.
As always, if you have any questions or concerns with regards to this lesson, please don't hesitate to leave a comment below.
Thank you very much for your continued support, and good luck with your Japanese studies!
Best from Beppu,
Dōgen
Comments
Hi Clare! Great question! The 仕事 and お仕事 set are actually part of the rule set I didn't cover for this lesson as it's a bit too complicated to try and remember in my opinion. I can't comment on your instinct to make お words 平板 because there are a lot of exceptions when it comes to honorifics (again, this is why I purposely only covered a select number of rules in this lesson), but it is true that while 仕事 is 平板, お仕事 is normally said as oSHIgoto. Sorry for not being able to help more with this—I try to avoid addressing overly complicated topics as it often gets me in trouble later!
Dogen
2021-02-21 05:13:33 +0000 UTCHi Dogen, this may be something you plan to cover in the next ep of the series, but I've noticed a specific, weird accent in the case of 仕事・お仕事. It sounds to me (and the OJAD lookup seems to back this up) like without the お, しごと is 平板, and when the お attaches, it becomes 中高, like oSHIgoto. This seems backward to me, as my instinct is to make most お words 平板 with the exception of the 2-mora rule you discussed in this video. Is this an exception, or my/OJAD's mistake, or an example of a rule that hasn't been covered yet?
Clare Kappenman
2021-02-20 15:55:20 +0000 UTCHi Joe—I actually don't recommend trying to do this, as I also find it to be very difficult and unproductive. This is why I recommend people do phonetics concentration periods in which they study pitch-accent and pronunciation intensively for several several months, and then stop and concentrate on other aspects of Japanese. I find that when you stop and start working on the other aspects of Japanese you'll still retain many of the important rules and information from the phonetics concentration period, simply from muscle memory, and thus that you no longer have to think about it, but are still able to speak with a much better accent than before. Hope this helps!
Dogen
2020-05-18 11:31:13 +0000 UTCHey! Unrelated question, but something that I've been finding difficult. I'm struggling with trying to simultaneously do pitch accent and also grasp the meaning of what it is I'm saying or reading. Have you got any advice on how to specially practise this or if I should practise it at all? Thanks!
Joe Griffiths
2020-05-18 11:19:03 +0000 UTCIt is indeed her!
Dogen
2020-05-16 12:48:49 +0000 UTCJust watched the ep. 7 about free resources and could the voice saying "tea / vinegar / hot water" be actually "strawberrybrown" from Forvo? It really reminds me of her voice :-)
Jan Bobro
2020-05-16 12:38:31 +0000 UTCMy pleasure Will! Glad to hear that you’re learning so much. Please be sure you’re also supplementing your phonetic studies with immersion in native media as well! Cheers!
Dogen
2020-05-16 02:28:43 +0000 UTCHi Dogen, just wanted to thank you for these amazing lessons. You rank as one of the best teachers I have ever encountered - I am working my way through the pronunciation and pitch accent lessons and am amazed by your ability to get inside the language and explain it so clearly. You are making these deep aspects of phonetics understandable in a way that a book would not be able to do, and I feel like it is giving me a great foundation for speaking Japanese.
Will Branch
2020-05-15 18:15:43 +0000 UTCHi Walt, I asked the speaker to say お湯が, and to me it sounds like a normal お, so I’m not sure why it would sound like a ご. Sorry for not being able to help more with this point!
Dogen
2020-05-14 22:57:54 +0000 UTCWhen the native speaker reads お湯が (at about time 2:32), my ears seem to hear ごすが rather than おすが, that is, she seems (to me) to be using the honorific ご rather than お. Have my ears gotten that bad in very old age?
Walt Poor
2020-05-14 22:44:31 +0000 UTCIndeed, that's still a fantastic option, however. Sadly not the best for more complex rules!
Dogen
2020-05-14 02:52:47 +0000 UTCI would love to get my hands on that accent dictionary but sadly I don't live in Japan. The best I can make do with is the IOS version of the NHK accent dictionary
greyface
2020-05-14 02:26:36 +0000 UTC
