How Does Anyone Not See the Fascism
Added 2024-10-14 21:58:21 +0000 UTCOA1077, Part 2 of Matt's MAGA is Fascist series.
The MAGA movement has just taken a hard turn to the extreme right with openly fascist messaging from Donald Trump about “migrant crime,” “occupied cities,” and “bad genes.” We take a moment to absorb this alarming reality before Matt also explains how US immigration policy has always been the leading edge of American protofascism--and why Adolf Hitler personally admired it--before taking a look at Trump’s actual 2024 immigration promises and what keeping them would mean for us all.
Hitler's American Model: The United States and the Making of Nazi Race Law, James Q. Whitman (2017)
“Trump Apparently Has a List of Things He Loves About Adolf Hitler,” Tori Otten The New Republic (3/11/24)
“Sweeping Raids, Giant Camps, and Mass Deportations: Inside Trump’s 2025 Immigration Plans,” Charlie Savage, Maggie Haberman, Jonathan Swan, The New York Times (11/23/2023)
Comments
I've never heard of anything like this happening after the ban went into place, but it is such obvious fallout from this policy that I don't know why I wouldn't have assumed it had. Thanks for sharing this!
Matt Cameron
2024-10-16 15:09:15 +0000 UTCSecond vote for Jesus and John Wayne. I thought "The Power Worshipers" by Katherine Stewart was great too. Almost goes without saying, but "The Family" should be on any list if you haven't read it.
Roy Thompson
2024-10-16 14:00:17 +0000 UTCOn “re-migration”: to me it opens the door to going beyond deporting immigrants. If my end goal was to remove first or second generation citizens because I didn’t like the color of their skin, I would reframe the conversation in terms of getting “those people” to “remigrate” back to where they came from instead of talking about deportation. Scary thought, but what seems like the next logical step if I were Stephen Miller.
Brendan O'Brien
2024-10-15 19:55:40 +0000 UTCJesus and John Wayne is also a great read in that direction! But yes, I like that idea--maybe there is some way that I can keep a running list of recommendations. I was even considering a monthly book club (or at least maybe a longform journalism club if we don't want to commit to that much reading) for patrons if there were enough interest.
Matt Cameron
2024-10-15 18:31:08 +0000 UTCFormer government cog here… Amazing episode!! USCIS also replaced the terms “customer/applicant” with “alien,” shut down all in-person services at the field+district offices, and began issuing NTAs (notices to appear in immigration removal court) to all whose applications are denied, regardless of why. For immigration purposes, “military aged men” refers to age 18-26, and all men must register in order to naturalize (become a US citizen.) And speaking of deporting groups with “bad genes,” maybe we take a look at the rate of rapists and serial killers among CBP/ICE/BP Officers themselves? Terrifying when such a group has no real oversight. Thanks for another one guys!
Status Quo Level Thing
2024-10-15 15:49:16 +0000 UTCMatt, I recommend Burning the Books by Richard Ovenden. It's a look at the systematic destruction of Books and archives. It's equally fascinating and horrifying.
Tara Churchill
2024-10-15 14:12:56 +0000 UTCI'd love a deep dive into the Nuremberg Trials. I just finished a documentary on Netflix and it is fascinating.
Tara Churchill
2024-10-15 14:08:39 +0000 UTCAn important point to mention whenever you see the word, “border, that is not limited to our land borders with Mexico and Canada. Those 50 or 100 miles from the border include our oceans.
Austin Flake
2024-10-15 04:57:05 +0000 UTCFantastic. I'm from a town in metro-Detroit, and the way this campaign is preying on the miseducation of folks who think hate explains the lack of what they have in their lives is so disheartening. I don't condone violence in any way, shape, or form, but my best friend in elementary school got suspended from riding the schoolbus for a year when she responded to another girl, who had taken to calling me "Vermin Herrmann" by punching her in the nose. I'll admit, It's hard not to look back at that memory and smile. Her Dad drove us to school for the rest of the school-year and let us blast whatever song we chose when we passed by our bus, so it was clear we were having a great time during our "punishment."
Katie Herrmann
2024-10-15 04:18:57 +0000 UTCUgh. The daily & krugman have to wait until tomorrow. I’m exhausted now.
dddebz
2024-10-15 04:08:49 +0000 UTCThe parallels are here. Have been here for a while. Sessions gets a pass for some reason, but he was Stephen Miller’s mentor, or at least boss for a long time. A YouTuber (I’d have to find it if you want it) mentioned Elon the other day as intentionally furthering the antisemitic and racist rise of far right stemming from his South Africa apartheid era. I haven’t been able to unsee the nazis since at least Charlottesville, and I continue to think 45 gets way too much credit for “plans” - he’s the front man, renting his name as he’s always done. Nothing else. The parallels in our media then, into Vietnam & Iraq (at least). Based on some deep dives into the gop’s successful propaganda - the tactics are very in line with 30s Germany because unfortunately they were *excellent* at that & have no problem using fiction to inspire their rhetoric. Thanks for helping shine the light on all the cracks; Americans do not need the government lying to us with the assistance of the 2 or 3 media companies controlling what is said to the public. It’s deplorable and embarrassing to me that we are watching what I’ve considered to be obvious continued fighting of the crusades in the Middle East on behalf of those in our leadership inclined towards coercive authoritarian oligarchic ethnostate theocracy. To me, those are all bad ideas for governance & public resources.
dddebz
2024-10-15 04:06:38 +0000 UTCAlso Matt, any chance of an Opening Args reading list? You are mentioning all of these books, I'd live to really melt my brain with them 😇 I recommend The Flag and the Cross by Philip Gorski and Samuel L. Perry for anyone interested in a look at how researchers have tried to measure and underdtand the specific American type of Christian Nationalism.
Jess C
2024-10-15 03:51:42 +0000 UTCGreat episode, although sickening. As part of the facism series, I am wondering if there's an expert you can get on who can help us understand how to talk about this to relatively low-information voters and people? How to introduce and frame ideas in terms which wont scare people away? I feel like all I can do is start spreading the word, but I find starting the conversation really hard because you cant just say "Trump etc are using the facism 101 playbook" (even though they absolutely are and anyone who's glanced at the rumblings of Nazism in the early 1930s can see that...particularly the changes in language and vilification of LGBTIQA+ people). I also wonder what to do about these problems, electoral 'solutions' aside. What is the next step beyond being a decent person who votes and rejects intolerance/hate in all forms 😵
Jess C
2024-10-15 03:46:05 +0000 UTCI just wanted to say that your opening thought here is exactly why I didn't want to do this as a one-off. As I said last week I don't think it is necessarily helpful to act as if the Third Reich presents a reliable model of what we can expect in the American 2020s with signposts that we can clearly point to along the way, any more than it is helpful to just call Trump a Nazi rather than point out the specific places where he directly resembles one. The MSM are still so reluctant to call this what it is, and it's honestly unfortunate that indies like us have to do it because the NYT still just can't bring themselves to (see the recent ep of the Daily and Krugman's column today)
Matt Cameron
2024-10-15 02:24:16 +0000 UTCI'll share a tangential impact of Trump's stupid policies. During the week after the Muslim ban, the military sent me on a mission to a Muslim country, maybe carrying 'sensitive' items. Previously, per agreement between our countries, US soldiers didn't need visas to enter this country. The Muslim immigration officers in that country suddenly had a change of heart. (Trump would have called this a "shithole" country, although I encountered nothing but wonderful folks.) I spent 5 hours in a standoff at the airport, holding a bag of very sensitive stuff, while feeling the flip side of Trump's racist policy. Perhaps, if the country had realized what I had, I could have been jailed and charged with a crime. The local immigration officers explicitly referred to the Muslim ban. These racist policies endanger Americans, even American military members.
We can feed everybody
2024-10-15 02:00:26 +0000 UTCI think it's more that the aggressors are doing THEIR will and blaming it on God. I'm not religious, but the actions of these people are in flagrant violation of the New Testament orders of Christ. Not that quoting the relevant passages ever does any good.
Maytree
2024-10-15 00:10:39 +0000 UTCPersonally, I think the shortcut of “nazi” or even “hitler”, without context, turns some non-fascist peoples’ brains off as (to quote SCOTUS when referring to women on the court) “hysterical”. Sorta like how it took me paying closer attention to officials’ use of minimizing or dehumanizing language re: Gaza=Hamas, Israeli hard right Zionist articulated policy of extermination, siege, starvation, annihilation, etc. We can draw straight lines from how US public & private institutions treated the Indigenous, Salem Witches, Slavery, Red Herring of communism, LGBTQ & non-conforming of any kind; because the aggressors believe they’re doing God’s will. Or protecting ppl from whatever “evil” they can claim is training our pockets today
dddebz
2024-10-14 23:31:23 +0000 UTCI think it's a combination of (1) "fascism is great as long as I agree with the goals of Der Fuhrer" and (2) lack of historical awareness of what Fascism does to the countries it takes over.
Maytree
2024-10-14 23:11:22 +0000 UTC"How Does Anyone Not See the Fascism" sunk cost maybe?
General Contact Unit Problem Child
2024-10-14 22:44:01 +0000 UTC
