[D'sP] Death Worlds - Chapter 187
Added 2022-01-21 12:11:59 +0000 UTCDoyle nods his core in response to Ally’s question. ‘Yeah, I didn’t quite have enough Wisdom to accept the Guild’s contract and keep the first floor automation and the two loot rules I have running.’
Ally looks really aggrieved at this. ‘So you, who had just recently reached the limits of your soul, decided to buy a new path? Didn’t the pain from before push it deep enough into your mind to not do that? You haven’t even gained a level! I’m surprised you didn’t howl out with pain so loudly that I could hear it even if you weren’t trying to talk with me.’
Doyle’s core flashes as the memory of the pain returns to him. It really wasn’t that long ago since he had completed his dungeon core path and felt that twisted mind rending pain. Then something else comes to mind. ‘I didn’t feel any pain this time?’
Ally frowns, ‘you should have? While your soul does grow with experience, both literal and figurative, the system isn’t as kind. Until you get that last tick of it to push you over into the next level, it treats you like you had the same limit as when you first reached your current level. Were you doing anything special to allocate the path points?’
Doyle shakes his head, ‘I was deciding whether or not to accept the contract and so after noticing I could use a few more points of Wisdom I spent the points on the path most likely to give me some. I said it exactly like I normally would and everything.’
Ally rubs the bridge of her nose, ‘I suspect I know how it happened and I suspect you might have gotten a bit deeper into debt. What likely happened is that the system allowed you to spend more path points than you were allowed in exchange for increasing your quintessence debt. Hopefully not at too steep of a price.’
Doyle’s core dims, ‘Why would it do that? Like, I know it likes the quintessence and so is all for putting me into debt, but I also don’t see why it would still cause all the pain and what not.’
Ally laughs, ‘Because you were still in the middle of reading the Guild contract of course. Whoever made the system likely had someone come by to talk with them about what should be included in as an exception. Now how about we check on the damages as I’m sure the system will be just as recalcitrant on telling us the new debt as it was in telling us the old one.’
Doyle nods, ‘[System what was the cost of buying my latest path and what is my current quintessence debt?]’
{The last path cost: 10pp, Quintessence debt where each point spent adds 0 plus 1 after every second point spent
Current Quintessence debt: 82.61}
Ally bites her thumb. ‘Yeah, that could have been a lot worse. If those first two points hadn’t been free, it would have cost 10 more quintessence. We probably owe whoever was sent to represent the guild for getting those freebies. It had taken us this long to get down to 60ish and if we had tipped over the 100 point things would have gotten nastier.
‘Still, as long as we owe more than 10 quintessence we’re going to be stuck with the slower world energy gain from delvers. That’s basically giving up our energy to the system for free without it even going towards the debt or anything. I can’t even imagine how much more you could have done so far if the system wasn’t taking some undetermined amount of power from us. Though I guess it is probably better than owing interest on the debt.’
Doyle can’t help but laugh, though stops after Ally shoots him a dirty look. Still, he can’t help but shake his core, ‘I had completely forgotten about the fact that my debt reduced how much world energy I get from delvers.’
When Ally hears that, she can’t help but let out a giggle as well. ‘Okay, that does deserve a bit of a laugh. But increasing your debt isn’t a laughing matter. Going over a debt of 100 is when the system starts increasing the penalties. I don’t know what the dungeon based penalties would be but think along the lines of holding back stat gains from your paths and such. Your grab for more Wisdom would have been quite the failure if at the point when you have gotten it on the path the system had already decided you wouldn’t get it.’
Doyle’s core goes almost dark before the glow returns, ‘That, that would have been bad. Why would the system get so persnickety at such an arbitrary point?’
Ally shrugs, ‘Cause it can? Other possibilities include that maybe that number was an unlucky amount to owe in the designer’s culture, someone thought the number was funny, or they rolled dice. Remember, for many of the core functions that don’t grow with the system, the reasons will boil down to one person wanting it that way.
‘Even the fact that it is just the system and not the System tells us something. My personal guess on that one is that whoever designed it originated from a universe that had a System. So when designing their own, it wasn’t the System, but rather just a system they were making.’
Doyle nods, ‘I guess that all makes as much sense as the next guess. Still, I’m glad I managed to stay under an arbitrary number. I should probably look into paying it back more actively. If I remember correctly, we had figured it would take something like 4 days of my natural power generation to generate a single quintessence? Though for some reason I feel like we’re missing something about the debt penalty?’
Ally frowns and brings up her notes. After reading them, she sighs, ‘Yeah, I misremembered a few things. It isn’t at 100 that the heavy penalties come in. For 100 and every power of ten, after that you gain 10% extra leveling experience. Also, just for having a debt you experience slower skill growth. The breaking point actually starts at 153 for some reason. Though I wasn’t wrong about not knowing what the penalty would be. I just have it marked as being a big breakpoint.’
Doyle groans, ‘So my skill growth has been stunted this whole time? That does bring up the question of what I would be doing with all those path points seeing as I already managed to cap that out. But yeah, I really need to pay down this debt if that is the case. Maybe back then I couldn’t afford to put in my full natural regen but now I basically don’t even use it.’
Ally nods, ‘That does sound like a good idea. Though maybe just limit it to when you have your poll capped? Don’t want to end up in a situation where you need more and don’t have it. As for your skill growth? You have to remember you aren’t leveling as fast as most dungeons would.
‘If you were on a planet that was already integrated with the system, you would be at least level 10 by now, even if a sapient population hadn’t found you. Not many monsters got here not because the draw isn’t powerful. Rather, there just weren’t many monsters in the first place. On a planet that has had at least a century go by, you would have had multiple monsters entering every day from the moment you entered. Not to mention if you were anywhere near a sapient population.
‘Dungeon deaths are, in most places a way of keeping their population and unemployment in check. Fools and their lives are soon parted, which is a quick and easy way for dungeons to level up. You might not have had as many deaths as with the monsters but each sapient death is worth more no matter how grim that sounds.’
Doyle sighs, ‘So I’m just growing slowly on all metrics?’
Ally shrugs, ‘Eh, not much you can do about it. On the bright side, you should have a more consistent growth instead. Dungeons tend to grow to the area’s level of competence and then stop. If a world rarely gets anyone above level 100, the dungeon isn’t going to be getting anywhere above that, with any great speed.
‘By having a captive audience, as it were, you can continue to grow as they do. Plus, the system tends to give a bit of a boost to the first generation after it arrives on a planet. Their kids might not be growing like they are, but you only need Ace and company to keep growing even without the death factor.’
Doyle tilts to the side, ‘Why would that matter all that much? I’m not exactly rolling in the levels right now and they’ve way out leveled me. I have floors they won’t get to for a while now.’
Ally nods, ‘You aren’t wrong in the short term. The thing is, each magnitude of levels increases the experience scaling. So while they’re ahead of you right now you will likely catch up at each of those break points. That and the fact that you will stay ahead of them with floors will keep it in check. There is a reason I used level 100 as a sticking point in that example.
‘Though I suspect that your world isn’t going to be one of those stuck there. You’ve already got a couple of gods personally sniffing around just you alone. Besides that, I can already feel a level of world energy out there high enough to support higher levels and it is growing.’
Doyle tilts back, ‘I can see that last bit being a problem.’
Ally laughs, ‘Well, yes, it can be. A world just needs to make sure there are enough high-level people to keep it in check.’
Doyle tilts back, ‘And if they don’t?’
Ally shrugs, ‘Well, we call those worlds, death worlds. Partly because monsters end up gaining the levels through growth and so they kill off the lower level sapient inhabitants. Mostly though because once monsters get far enough ahead they corrupt the local world’s energy. This is technically fixable but it is much cheaper to just move.
‘See, what that corruption does is increase the chance of monsterification. After all, you can have an animal with mana but it isn’t a monster. Once the world energy has monster energy in it, though, that is a whole lot harder. Worse yet, more things can become monsters.
‘Because normally it takes either some sort of special condition for a stone golem to just form out of a natural rock. On a monster world, it isn’t out of the question for a mountain to just stand up and walk away. Extreme examples of this include having any local moons turn into golems. That is only if the other local monsters don’t take over the mountain first. A mountain with a dragon living in it isn’t going to come alive on you even if that situation might be more survivable.’
Doyle sighs, ‘And of course either way I would come out ahead.’
Ally shrugs again, ‘Dungeons just sort of are. After all, eventually even the most monstrous world will end up with sapients, even if they are all monsters. Dungeons are honestly the species that has the hardest time waking up to full sapience. I guess it makes up for their massive innate ability. Gotta keep that soul asleep to keep things fair.’
Doyle shakes his core, ‘I don’t want fair, I want strategically unfair in my favor.’
Ally snorts, ‘Well, you got it. After all, you’re an awakened dungeon already. Can’t get much more unfair than that unless the rumors of certain monsters being able to naturally grow into true immortals is true.’
Turn About Is Fair Play - Chapter 186
A New Motivation For The Town - Chapter 188
Comments
Fair enough
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-06-18 04:48:38 +0000 UTCThat makes sense! I would suggest having doyle point out the (seemingly obvious but not to me) issue, especially given that he’s prevented from taking new paths due to his low level.
Oliver Wolfe
2022-06-18 04:47:32 +0000 UTCIt is an increase and the penalty is that you would level faster. Remember, levels in and of themselves don't actually give anything. Everything is tied into the paths you have taken which give stats per level. The slower you level and the more paths you get early on, the stronger you will be in the long run. Doyle is one of the rare examples of someone leveling too slowly and getting a bit stuck.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-06-18 04:46:21 +0000 UTCOtherwise I’m completely missing how this would be a penalty
Oliver Wolfe
2022-06-18 04:18:53 +0000 UTCYou’ve written this before but the following language implies that his experience would *increase* by ten percent when I believe you mean it would be a 10 percent decrease in experience gain: “ For 100 and every power of ten, after that you gain 10% extra leveling experience.”
Oliver Wolfe
2022-06-18 04:17:57 +0000 UTCThe thing to remember about the system is that it is overlaid upon reality and not reality itself so things that are "natural" while represented in the system might not match exactly what the system shows. A good example of this is the stats themselves. Just a straight number without any decimal places involved. If that was how reality actually was then everyone with 10 strength would be able to lift exactly the same amount of weight. Instead, the system is able to boil things down such that all the things that represent strength are calculated into that number. Now with that explained I can return to how Doyle seems to exceed the limit of his soul. As with most growth it doesn't happen in specific steps but rather gradually. What the system does is take the limit of a person's soul shell when they reach a new level and make that the cap until they level up again. Importantly, this isn't some simple restriction but rather something more real than not. A True Immortal can tell if a person originates from a system based universe because the soul will develop like a tree with each level being a new ring. Doyle however has managed to get into one of those tricky situations that wasn't really meant to happen. A previous example of this is his adventurers in being a goat. The difference here is that this situation, needing to use more of his soul shell than currently available because of an outside influence, is a lot more common than a dungeon being stuck in a loop and having a fairy there to call in help. The debt he takes on is basically the system charging him for starting a new growth ring in his soul shell and overcharging him of course. As for why he was allowed to overspend? Well, the system is greedy. It could have stopped him cold at the seventh point. It could have even stopped him from spending them at all as he technically didn't need to, but that wouldn't have earned the system anything.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-02-10 06:46:15 +0000 UTCI don’t get it. I thought the pain and not being able to take more paths was a literal limit of his soul shell. How did taking more debt surpass that limit? Also, he got the wisdom from point 7 of 10, if this was some emergency loan (?) that somehow exceeded the explode limit of his soul shell, wouldn’t it have run out before he finished the path?
Drew Allan Coon
2022-02-10 06:27:25 +0000 UTCThey know but don't have much right now. Anything they would want has been already tossed in at the start. As it is now they just have to wait for their crafters to make some better stuff.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-01-23 09:42:16 +0000 UTCThat makes sense. Did the settlement ever figure out that leaving stuff may cause it to spawn in the dungeon? I know they left a package in the begining, put they haven't tried it since. Like since the woodcarvers lack good wood, they may try to leave some trees inside. Or are they afraid of making the dungeon stronger?
Gabor Elem
2022-01-23 09:36:52 +0000 UTCDoyle will not talk with the town during the story. There isn't anything stopping it in universe. Rather, one of my goals in writing this story was to write a dungeon core novel based around how I believed they should be done to stay as a dungeon core novel. I've read a ton of dungeon core novels and I noticed, once the dungeon begins open discourse with those outside, they lose some of the "dungeon-ness" they had. I won't write off the possibility of beings from the dungeon communicating with the town mind you. Just that Doyle and Ally will not directly talk to them. They won't necessarily hide the fact that Doyle is awake, just who he is/was.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-01-23 05:32:13 +0000 UTCOne important thing to remember is that dungeons do not wake up. This does not mean they can't, the story starts with one of them messing with Doyle. Rather, because of how short the life of a universe is, a dungeon will not wake up without special circumstances. To put it another way, if you want to think of the chance to wake up as a percentage it would start as high as -100% but most way less. So not only do you need to increase the chance of it happening, you have to massively increase it. The debt is to keep a dungeon that hasn't awakened (and a few other special entities) in hand while being "fair". After all, even if the dungeon isn't quite able to make use of things actively, they still have souls and so in theory could. Now what do you think would happen if a dungeon created a goblin boss? The dungeon isn't able to think about things so much but that goblin boss can and thus a dungeon master is born. Except a dungeon master doesn't get access to the dungeon and can only prod it in certain directions.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-01-23 05:26:57 +0000 UTCCan't wait for Doyle to start communicating with the town :) Maybe with Jim, since he can't kill him. Would be cool if he sent them kindof patchnotes, pretending to be part of the system. Also, since the adventurer contract is formed with awakened dungeons, does Jim know already? :)
Gabor Elem
2022-01-22 18:44:22 +0000 UTCThat was actually intended to be a play on words. He isn't thinking ahead, he lacks foresight, wisdom. He also is in short supply on Wisdom. *Ba-dum-tsh*
Carl Mason
2022-01-22 18:11:59 +0000 UTCIf a dungeon were to 'wake up' at, what, over one hundred floors, it would be really fucking dangerous when it started blindly experimenting with no limits in place. So I agree, the debt is probably in place to render them practically level one instead.
vanar
2022-01-22 17:27:30 +0000 UTCI bet the system is design in the way that it use debt to limit dungeons. Since most of them are not awake to start with their debt must be massive.
Nathan
2022-01-22 15:31:49 +0000 UTCWinky Face! Though I put a few things in this chapter so don't know what it goes to.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-01-21 20:37:50 +0000 UTCLess foreshadowing and more world building without directly stating it to be true. Now it is known that those things exist in myth so could exist in reality. As for the death world thing? That is just following the example set by Warhammer 40k and a number of other scifi settings. Though the moon thing is a reference to a story I read in the past.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-01-21 20:36:53 +0000 UTCCarl mostly has it right. Though it is less of a lack of Wisdom and more that the system hasn't really shown itself to be configurable. And yes, the system will not warn you for that kind of stuff.
Akhier Dragonheart
2022-01-21 20:34:35 +0000 UTCAnd I do love that "Death worlds is the title of chapter 187, which as far as I know (admittedly, not very far) is the police/emergency dispatch code for someone getting killed.
Carl Mason
2022-01-21 18:17:34 +0000 UTCHe lacks the Wisdom to set that up. And the system probably would not cooperate, it wants dungeons to get into debt without knowing it.
Carl Mason
2022-01-21 16:00:02 +0000 UTCa thought. why does doyle not ask the system for a prompt to appear when he is about to increase his debt?
zalex
2022-01-21 15:32:05 +0000 UTCWhy does last sentence sound like foreshadowing...
Carl Mason
2022-01-21 14:49:38 +0000 UTC;)
Zarik0
2022-01-21 14:00:17 +0000 UTC