UNCUT - Suddenly Human (TNG S4E4) | Star Trek Journey 185
Added 2024-09-01 15:31:37 +0000 UTCNOTE - I am working on getting a Dropbox open for the downloadable versions. Hoping to have this done today. Once available the download link will be put into the posts.
Comments
This was like the first episode of S4 that i wasn't really into all that much, saying that though it was a solid story id say a C for me.
The Darkside Gamer
2024-09-11 22:04:33 +0000 UTCI wonder if the Tellarians are in system with, or an offshoot of the Tellerites from TOS - "Sarek of Vulcan! How do YOU vote?"
Owen Madden
2024-09-11 19:17:12 +0000 UTCHoly shit how did I never realize this???
Todd Pritchett
2024-09-04 02:41:12 +0000 UTCSherman Howard also plays a fantastic Lex Luthor in the 1988-1992 live action Adventures of Superboy tv series.
Matt Everkoul
2024-09-04 02:15:37 +0000 UTCYes, indeed, a great TV series. When NBC was paving the way with great, more realistic and serialized dramas like Hill Street Blues, LA Law, and of course, St. Elsewhere.
Collin Freeman
2024-09-03 02:43:13 +0000 UTCAlex gave BOBW part 2 a B.
D Jammers
2024-09-02 14:44:30 +0000 UTCI enjoyed this episode much more watching it with Alex and Josh. Where does Picard get the authority to make this decision about the boy? I think he’s going to have some explaining to do with the feds.
T’Pynyn of Vulcan
2024-09-02 04:58:28 +0000 UTCUnlike "When the Bough Breaks" I guess the damage was already done, huh.
Jovet
2024-09-02 02:24:58 +0000 UTCD for me. Not one of their best. No great dialog, very predictable, full of plot conveniences. Beverly and Diana added contrived and predictable stakes. Acting, meh. Totally forgetable episode.
Michael Metrick
2024-09-02 02:18:21 +0000 UTCHe is indeed that kid! lol And its amazing how far it goes if you really want to dig into it. Nearly all television is smuggled into the Tommy Westphall Universe one way or another! St. Elsewhere was, incidentally, a pretty darn good show in its own right ... I remember watching it when I was a kid with my mom, so I have fond memories!
Joshua Taylor
2024-09-02 02:05:04 +0000 UTCI assume Troi's empathic abilities allow her to be a little more hands off than would be conventional?
Nolan
2024-09-02 02:02:36 +0000 UTCWait, he's THAT kid?! Also that "universe" is just such a bonkers thing. Only TV fanatics would think that much about it, and that's why I kinda love it, because it's like some deep lore about TV watching you almost have to "ascend" far enough into to uncover.
Nolan
2024-09-02 02:00:36 +0000 UTCApparently he personally wasn't the one that killed him but yes your point stands. I am okay with the ending but I always felt it would be better of Jono talked directly to his grandma (the whole subspace distance thing gets fubbed around a lot) and if Endar gave assurance that Jono would be able to speak with and visit humans and leave when he wants. Blah blah blah.
Greg Quinn
2024-09-02 01:41:21 +0000 UTCHey I just looked up Sherman Howard. He played Bub.
Greg Quinn
2024-09-02 01:35:51 +0000 UTC@Jeff already mentioned Chad Allen's acting chops, but I have to ask if you guys are familiar with the Tommy Westphal universe that ties virtually all of TV-dom together through his character on St. Elsewhere. It's absolutely wild and worth going down the rabbit hole if you haven't! Chad Allen is, for that reason alone, television royalty!!
Joshua Taylor
2024-09-02 00:21:26 +0000 UTCSolid discussion on this one, a few missed plot details aside. I think a lot of people agree that it was a wasted opportunity to not involve Worf more in the story given his similar background. I think as you guys suggested having 1 more scene where he talks to Worf about why he stayed would have been a big improvement. Also that Wesley burn was chef's kiss. One thing that seemed lacking was why wasn't Troi corroborating whether both Jono and Endar were being truthful. Obviously it was wrong to just take a child whose parents died in an attack he was leading. But then the talarians wouldn't see it that way. But over a decade later, if indeed Jono's injuries were accidents and not abuse, I think at that point ripping him away from the only life he knows would do more harm than good. He should have been given all the facts and allowed to make the choice himself. It's not amazing but it's not bad either.
Timothy Nikiforovs
2024-09-02 00:02:35 +0000 UTCTrue. One of the best laughs I've had in a while.
Timothy Nikiforovs
2024-09-01 23:44:41 +0000 UTCPoor Wesley. 🤦
Jovet
2024-09-01 23:38:53 +0000 UTCThere's the Patreon Exclusive™!
Jovet
2024-09-01 23:37:20 +0000 UTCToo right!!
Jovet
2024-09-01 23:33:43 +0000 UTCThe difference between Worf and Jono is that Worf's adoptive parents let him explore the culture of his heritage, and allowed it to be a part of him, whereas Jono's did not. THAT would've been a meaty discussion scene. But it also would have probably pissed off all the adopting missionaries back then, who, speaking as a mild Christian myself, were more concerned about spreading the "good news" this way than they were for the kids mental well-being. The fact Endar seemed to have swept Jono's humanity under the rug is probably why he was viewed with suspicion, since we've see the opposite with Worf - and of course, it's wrong for them to have done this to Jono because our society is better, their's is "backwards" The episode really just needed to crystalize this. Instead all we get is Worf telling the kid, "No, I'm free, now shut up." and then he effs off for the rest of the episode. Wasted potential. The greatest sin Star Trek can commit.
Nolan
2024-09-01 23:13:23 +0000 UTCNotes from someone who works in the ER, lol. The kid needs to be sent to a psych facility and that's something that does not need to be done with consent. That is something Deanna Troi should be able to order. Jono was kidnapped by people that slaughtered the colony he and his parents lived. Just because he lived out a life with his captors does not excuse the actions of the past. And the scene where Jono reunites with Endar, that was wrong. It should not have happed and Troi should have stepped in when Jono was presented with a choice by Endar. That is classic manipulation. Both Picard and Troi also should not have been turned away from them. That is DEFINITELY a situation in which you want to observe the interaction and insure the safety and wellbeing of Jono. Also, the stories Endar used to explain Jono's past injuries should have been corroborated with Jono, and the word of a kidnapper should not have been trusted. And clearly Jono should not have been staying in Picard's quarters. He should have been in a room where he cannot do harm to himself or anyone else and have continuous watch. But all in all it was a decent episode LOL! I honestly forgot about this episode.
Ricky
2024-09-01 21:55:38 +0000 UTCYou mentioned Seinfeld and I realized THAT is where I remember seeing the actor Sherman Howard from. He was in The Junior Mint episode. He played Elaine's boyfriend who was in the hospital and gets an operation, then Kramer's junior mint ends up landing in the open incision cavity.
Collin Freeman
2024-09-01 21:42:10 +0000 UTCI felt the same way: C+/B-
Collin Freeman
2024-09-01 21:09:07 +0000 UTCThis has a top 5 shit on Wesley moment in the series. Clearly, “Shut up, Wesley!” And Beverly slapping him rank higher.
EnigmaticPenguin
2024-09-01 20:26:47 +0000 UTCStar Trek 7: The Wrath of Jono
Joe Concepts
2024-09-01 19:56:42 +0000 UTC1:13:06 The point needs made that Endar killing Jono's parents and claiming Jono as his own is abusive. Having feelings for the boy after the fact is pretty irrelevant.
Jovet
2024-09-01 19:41:22 +0000 UTCMore time would have probably helped him, but the episode didn't have or give that.
Jovet
2024-09-01 19:38:57 +0000 UTCHe starred in Dr Quinn a few years after this episode
Lwaxana’s Poolboy
2024-09-01 19:22:39 +0000 UTCYour Wesley burn in Ten Forward was S tier
James Bottas
2024-09-01 19:20:17 +0000 UTCIt's a pretty sad episode. I don't enjoy it. I don't hate it. The boy has been traumatized and brainwashed and nobody seems to recognize that TIME is what is needed for him to realize whom he is and whom he is not. But it's practically a bottle episode, so time isn't an option.
Jovet
2024-09-01 19:20:10 +0000 UTCThe element of Talarians having a patriarchal society was simply added so that the job of getting through to Jono would go to Picard and not Troi or Crusher.
James Bottas
2024-09-01 19:19:03 +0000 UTCConnor, Moira (Máire), Connaught—all good Irish names. Shame O'Brien wasn't in this episode, huh?
Jovet
2024-09-01 19:17:21 +0000 UTCI don't necessarily think the kid did a "good" job, but I also think the role was actually very challenging especially for a young actor. A human who was raised in another repressed society, has PTSD, has to make weird noises, and has lots of scenes where he has to shout and be angry. Not a great performance, but I think he did his best.
Deep Red
2024-09-01 19:16:11 +0000 UTC53:00 Wrong. He did attack the colony. Endar was "in charge" of the Talarian forces that attacked it. The Talarian "tradition" under which Endar claimed Jono as a child is because enemies killed his son and so he may claim the son of an enemy that he (his forces) has slain.
Jovet
2024-09-01 19:14:44 +0000 UTC@52:52 pretty sure it was them that fought the federation and killed the parents
Derek Orr
2024-09-01 19:14:24 +0000 UTCHuh?
Derek Orr
2024-09-01 19:04:08 +0000 UTCSheer hubris :)
Derek Orr
2024-09-01 19:02:53 +0000 UTCYa I bet that Admiral was shocked at Picards sheer f’king hubris in not telling her what was going on
Derek Orr
2024-09-01 19:02:34 +0000 UTCThat’s particularly creepy
Derek Orr
2024-09-01 19:00:53 +0000 UTCVery cool!
Derek Orr
2024-09-01 18:58:45 +0000 UTCSometimes they are too far for instant coms, other times there is a delay like in this episode Lots of 80s vibes…the admiral immediately saying I’m glad your able to continue the family line…and also Dr crusher doing the whole i have a kid your age, do you want to meet him🙄 It’s weird that these guys where ever at war with the federation…they are no match for starfleet ships …like they use rockets lol The whole picard and troi standing in the corner with their backs to them was awkward. Like I get the intent but it was just weird
Derek Orr
2024-09-01 18:57:36 +0000 UTC32:02 Because the distance to Earth precludes real-time communication.
Jovet
2024-09-01 18:51:52 +0000 UTC27:53 Gotta touch forehead ridges for affection.
Jovet
2024-09-01 18:46:53 +0000 UTCI enjoyed this reaction and discussion more than any other despite the episode not being as strong. IMO, the Rewriter's Room was perfect here. I suggest you guys pick one thing each you'd like to change and keep it to that. That will help it feel like a nerd discussion and not nitpicky (which turns some fans off). And the point about Worf is a great one. He chose to stay with those who raised him instead of returning to the Klingon empire. Plus, he could've shown Jono that you can honor your biological culture while immersing yourself in your chosen culture. It could've been powerful thematically. Instead, they continued with the "Picard doesn't like kids" storyline.
Justin B
2024-09-01 18:39:21 +0000 UTCThis is an episode where giving it a C feels a little low, yet giving it a B feels a little high.
Forbidden Donut
2024-09-01 18:22:52 +0000 UTCRight? The poor woman was teased by the idea of seeing her presumed dead grandson, and then had it ripped away.
Lwaxana’s Poolboy
2024-09-01 17:56:48 +0000 UTCI also think that, paradoxically, child actors often do a better job in this kind of role than they do playing more of a normal kid.
Steven Linden
2024-09-01 17:45:25 +0000 UTCChad Allen (Jono) was a well-known child actor who was on the tv series "St. Elsewhere" in which he played the autistic son of a doctor. He was then on the family drama series "Our House" and later on the western drama "Dr. Quinn, Medicine Woman." When he was 21 he was outed as gay by a tabloid, and soon became an activist for LGBT causes. He continued acting until 2015 when he retired. Today, at 50 years old, he is a clinical psychologist, which is kind of a nice full circle since this episode deals so much with Jono's psychology.
Jeff
2024-09-01 17:41:08 +0000 UTCWhat makes him stand out is how much his performance mirrors that of his 'father'. That's not easy.
#MaxwellDidNothingWrong
2024-09-01 17:37:57 +0000 UTCNext time on STAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR TREK Picard and the gang roleplay as CPS and conclude there is a statue of limitations on child trafficking.
#MaxwellDidNothingWrong
2024-09-01 17:36:09 +0000 UTCThe actor, Chad Allen, had been a successful TV actor for years before this. He was in the main cast of series before and after this, so makes sense he was pretty good.
Joe Concepts
2024-09-01 17:31:50 +0000 UTCI thought Jono was one of the better child actors we've seen on Star Trek so far. This one's a solid B for me, despite some flaws.
Steven Linden
2024-09-01 17:18:17 +0000 UTC😳
Josh (Target Audience)
2024-09-01 17:03:02 +0000 UTCC tier feels right it’s fine rocky beginning interesting ending no easy resolution either. I like an episode which does the unexpected.
Darren Seal
2024-09-01 17:01:51 +0000 UTCinteresting fact, him stabbing Picard is a real thing called pull/push that happen a lot with mental struggling children, they start to get better and connect with the one helping them, then suddenly revert some times even violently, it actually them coming to a realization they are leaving there old life behind and it scares them and also test if the carer will stick with them even after they acted violently towards them like a trust test
Dark Kronis
2024-09-01 16:58:42 +0000 UTCC+ Episode
Josef Nitervol
2024-09-01 16:56:31 +0000 UTCBetter than I remembered. But was the Admiral/grandmother okay with that outcome? Did Picard even ask her?
Sam Langanke
2024-09-01 16:56:00 +0000 UTCAgreed, I had remembered this being D tier, but then rewatched it and I can see C+ being argued. It's that first half that really brings you down.
Paul
2024-09-01 16:55:32 +0000 UTCJosh was riding what?🤔
Ramen Nudels
2024-09-01 16:49:53 +0000 UTCIt wasnt as bad as I remembered it. For me it was a B to high C tier episode.
Lucas Kane
2024-09-01 16:33:54 +0000 UTCNever realized Jono’s mom basically shares the same name with the mom from Schitt’s Creek.
Lwaxana’s Poolboy
2024-09-01 16:24:19 +0000 UTCSpoiler. After this episode Jono was pulled into a time warp and appeared on 19th century Earth, where he discovered his humanity in Colorado Springs.
Lwaxana’s Poolboy
2024-09-01 16:20:44 +0000 UTCAbsolutely loved the Wesley roasting!
THE LORE!!!
2024-09-01 16:17:46 +0000 UTC
