partial rough cut of very silly video (feedback desired!)
Added 2024-05-17 20:05:23 +0000 UTChey weirdos, this is an odd thing I'm working on:
List of Songs that Represent "Smart Music" Ranked From Most to Least Appropriate to Put in a Video Essay
this edit is only the main body of the video. it's missing the intro (which explains why the rankings are in a seemingly random order... sort of) and the conclusion (which gives a LITTLE more context for the mechanics of the list, but not much).
this is probably the weirdest video I've ever made, so I am soliciting your input. I am aware that the audio leveling is all over the place, and the pacing between segments is weird, and it just kinda starts and stops without the intro and conclusion. these are known issues. I am more curious about the following:
wtf even is this?
is this interesting? funny? boring? annoying?
are you like TOTALLY lost without more context?
would context make it WORSE?
is this the good kind of pretentious or the bad kind?
how is this landing?
how many oscars would this win if it were a slow year?
etc.
input welcome, ok thanks.
-I
Comments
P.S.: The only thing I don't understand is the order. (And I feel like the "he'll be Bach" joke would be stronger if the two pieces weren't Bach-to-Bach.)
PLM
2024-05-21 18:32:25 +0000 UTCI very much enjoyed this. Four thoughts: * I didn't understand the randomness of the order * My main thought as each one was revealed was "This is Adagio for Strings erasure" * I had to look up that Duo Des Fleurs was NOT in Shawshank Redemption * The clip from the Good Place has to go in the Spigel section. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1IchzbtNj0
David Lu!!
2024-05-21 16:43:45 +0000 UTCPachelbel will feature in the outro 😈
Ian Danskin
2024-05-20 01:40:01 +0000 UTCContext might help. Also including Canon in D as a punchline somehow might be funny 🤷♂️
Scoott
2024-05-19 11:51:10 +0000 UTCLove the Bach pun, love the way you articulate your thoughts as always and love that you keep surprising me with themes. Can't wait for it to drop.
Tu peux toujours Chercher
2024-05-19 11:15:20 +0000 UTCThat said, I also got the sense that feeling confused and a bit alienated was maybe the point? It was like somebody describing a dream that they had
Clayton LeVerrier
2024-05-19 04:37:46 +0000 UTCI'm definitely in the camp of "this was interesting but also confusing" and I'm not totally sure if I get it. You acknowledge that the clip doesn't contain context for why they're in the order they're in, but I also didn't particularly understand what the things you had to say about each song had to do with the premise of the video? It read to me like "here are some songs that are often used in similar contexts that I have opinions about" but then also they were being ranked according to some criteria that I didn't follow.
Clayton LeVerrier
2024-05-19 04:33:37 +0000 UTCPersonally, as far as the numbers go I think it could do with some degree of signalling that them being out of order isn't a *mistake* before the outro, because I nearly went back to see I hadn't missed anything and then thought it was some kind of glitch before deciding it must be a product of it being a rough draft (my ADHD ass impulsively started watching before reading past the first sentence giving the topic). Even just a glib little reference to it, like a line like "and of course after nine we have... number two." You know, just something nodding to it so even the dummies in the audience like me know it's not some kind of mistake or issue. Other than that, I think that not cluing us in until the end would fit the tone really well. I do think that it's possible, maybe even easy, to ruin the "wtf" factor by adding too much information in the info. I think the perfect tone for this would be to give *just* enough context between the title and perhaps a quick introduction that the audience is teetering on the edge rather than just being flung out into space. I think that could range from just a little bit of straight up contextual info (so long as it sylistically keeps with the tone) to just a cheeky introductory acknowledgement that makes the audience 90% sure the disorientation is intentional, and it would function just the same. To sum up, on the whole I think your audience is savvy enough to understand inference and enjoy a little surrealist ride (whether or not we ever get context from the number order), but just a tiny injection of context or audience reassurance would go a long way to making sure nobody ends up *too* confused to enjoy it.
Alexander Powers
2024-05-18 23:37:53 +0000 UTCif there's more context in the intro, does that remove enjoyment of the "wtf?" vibes? rn there is context planned for the outro, having people get through the list before fully understanding it beyond the pitch, and I'm debating whether that is more or less fun than putting the full context in the intro...
Ian Danskin
2024-05-18 22:41:10 +0000 UTCI thought it was just the right amount of funny and weird as is, definitely not too pretentious. I think without a little more context I would be confused enough to possibly turn away from the video before finishing it, though- taking the video as standalone and ignoring your written explanation. Personally, I'd recommend an intro but no conclusion. I think it's funnier if it just abruptly ends, and it doesn't feel to me like it would benefit from a conclusion, just maybe a little more context in an intro that isn't explicitly named as such.
Alexander Powers
2024-05-18 21:46:37 +0000 UTCThat's what's so great about Cid (Eminence In Shadow) using Moonlight Sonata as his theme. It's universally recognized as smart and dramatic to the point of cliche, and that's what Cid is all about, the cliche chuuni edgelord. Cid is to chuuni isekai power fantasy as Saitama (One Punch Man) is to shonen power-leveling.
PC Escobar
2024-05-18 16:06:01 +0000 UTC(1) This is something that I didn't know I needed but now I must have. (2) Interesting and just the right amount of funny -- any more would tilt over into lampoon. And the humor is SMART funny, apropos to the theme. (3) You're right to ask about context. The only additional context I felt I needed was an explanation for the ordering. Bach after Bach for the He'll Be Bach joke is self-evident, but the rest needs at least some kind of explainer. I wouldn't go beyond that, though. The script and visuals explain themselves well enough. (4) I think there is a danger of overloading with too much context, yes. (5) I think you defuse any accusation of pretentiousness with the Spiegel Im Spiegel part. But even without that, I think it's fine. The humor and unexpected intertextual references (I was not expecting Earthworm Jim 2) keep it grounded. (6) Stuck the landing, 10/10. (7) None. It has a video game, a cartoon (Avatar), and another cartoon (Wayne's World), in it, which automatically disqualifies it for an Oscar. And now I need to advocate for the addition of an opera piece in general and Wagner in particular. I don't think any list of smart music can call itself complete without some Wagner in it. After all, Warner Bros cartoons wouldn't exist without Wagner. I learned more about art and culture from Bugs Bunny than I ever did at school.
PC Escobar
2024-05-18 15:49:11 +0000 UTCOkay, so this sits weird with me. It is in this space, where I THINK I am close to understanding what this is and I want just a LITTLE more context but on the other hand it is almost surreal enough that context would take away from it. I'd say either lean into the surrealism (for example by making a few of the remarks on video essays more cryptic and bury that context and ending the video without elaborating ANYTHING) or fully clarify what this is in the intro and/or conclusion. xD Also, this somehow reminded me of Jon Bois and Summoning Salt. ...and I am intrigued, to my surprise. This usually wouldn't be my cup of tea, not without knowing what I am going into here. But on some level it just... works. xD
Sethur
2024-05-18 11:05:37 +0000 UTCAs an uncultured pleb, I found this hilarious. It reminded me of the tutorial sections in Wario Ware: Smooth Moves, where an utterly mundane topic is presented with over-the-top high-class poshness. You committed 100% to the bit, and I love it. Be aware, though, that you will have to update your bio to "12th most pretentious person on YouTube".
PLM
2024-05-18 08:41:47 +0000 UTCI laughed at you laughing at your own dumb Bach joke and the "I believe in us" line. I think the narration either needs to fully commit to a bit (at least during the lost) or be a bit closer in tone the the usual cadence. Also I can't believe Clint Mansell's requiem for a dream didn't make it in : )
Richard M
2024-05-18 08:05:19 +0000 UTCknow nothing whatsoever about music: this mostly works! i think the slow and delicate delivery style was, for me, maybe not funny enough to justify how affected it made the whole thing feel? but that's just personal preference on delivery style, the core conceit is totally worthwhile
amber autumn faebrooke
2024-05-18 07:58:20 +0000 UTCAs someone who barely knows anything about classical music, I still found it amusing. Even for just the absurdity of it, and the opportunity to reminisce about old essays I've watched and poke a little fun at them. I did get a little lost in the middle about whether this was talking about songs in video essays specifically or essays and movies, but I bet the intro would help. Overall worth a chuckle, and probably a real win with people who are more pretentious than I.
Mateo Schwartz-Torres
2024-05-18 05:04:13 +0000 UTCI really loved the journey of this video: from music as signifier of intellectual aspiration to anxiety of the music overwhelming the content to the potential introduction of new trends. I enjoyed how Spiegel im Spiegel enters the video in a place that would seem the edge of acceptability (ie bottom of the list) but emerges as a potential future. The point about Pärt's recent popularity in indie films tied to the earlier mentions of pieces trickling down from film to ads to YT content. The video is a beautiful mix of sincerity and ironic humor. Seconding the earlier comments by @xanna (I'm also a classical music kid and agree that on all points) and @Alice (that this is "the good kind of pretentious" and to add a bit of intro/outro)
Emily Kugler
2024-05-18 04:33:30 +0000 UTCLoling at this! Major “You can’t stop me!” energy in a good way
Trevor Davison
2024-05-18 03:01:12 +0000 UTCDefinitely the good kind of pretentious. Just add a bit of an intro/outro, and it’ll be great!
Alice
2024-05-18 02:12:05 +0000 UTCI don't entirely understand it, but it's interesting. More context would definitely be helpful, if only in the form of the intro. I'm not sure if it's the good kind of pretension, but it definitely feels like the harmless kind. "You and I both know that none of this has any stakes or real consequence, so let's go down this list of songs and judge how acceptable they would be in a video essay."
Raymond Price
2024-05-18 01:45:11 +0000 UTCDon't know what this is or how it works exactly, but I enjoyed it very much. An earful
J Savage
2024-05-17 23:47:34 +0000 UTCI thought this was pretty funny, and I’ve got a classical music-loving friend that I *definitely* need to share this with once you publish the final version. I actually totally forgot EEAAO used Clair de Lune, my primary associations with it are video games: the first chapter of Danganronpa V3, the save rooms in The Evil Within (also scored by Masafumi Takada, I think he just really likes the song), the opening of Quadrilateral Cowboy, and the first level of Sayonara Wild Hearts. However, the #1 thing I associate it with is the vehicle physics simulation BeamNG.drive, which doesn’t itself feature the song but is the subject of Car Boys, the Griffin McElroy YouTube series (somewhat tainted by the cancellation of cohost Nick Robinson), which makes frequent use of Clair de Lune. As for Moonlight Sonata, I think my ability to take it seriously has been thoroughly damaged by the anime Eminence in Shadow, where it is the idiot edgelord protagonist’s favorite piece of music and there’s a gag where he makes some offscreen use of his bullshit isekai powers to steal an entire piano and transport it underground so that another character can come across him playing Moonlight Sonata while looking as cool and dramatic as possible, it’s hilarious.
Luke Beeman
2024-05-17 22:26:31 +0000 UTCI thought I'd be the right audience of this video, and indeed I loved it. But I don't think I get, most of the rationale behind most opinions and arguments made behind the ranking, and I didn't leave the video understanding what makes a song appropriate/not appropriate as a "smart" piece in your opinion. I recognized all the songs, and think I have opinions about their use in media, but I definitely don't think I could name most places I remember hearing the songs used, until they were mentioned. I love this concept, but for me I could have used a bit more concrete examples because the arguments are so interesting lol, I just wish I got all of them. Loved the jumping around the ranking list tbh! If I understood the ranking more id probably appreciate the thought behind the order you chose.
Alex J
2024-05-17 22:17:20 +0000 UTCTo be clear, I don't think every video by my favourite creators has to me for me. I think that's totally fine.
Charlotte KL
2024-05-17 21:47:03 +0000 UTCOh, and a propos of nothing, there's a really nice a cappella/ choral version of Air on G-string that my choir did recently. I love it.
Charlotte KL
2024-05-17 21:45:45 +0000 UTCI don't feel talked down to and I don't think it's bad pretentious, but I also don't really understand it. I lack too much context, chiefly on the films that these are being used on (I was just thinking "oh pretty music" or "I love this one!" for each piece). I'd also not watched the Cornetto trilogy films, but I understand and love the video. I'd still watch this, but probably not understand.
Charlotte KL
2024-05-17 21:44:42 +0000 UTCSo I enjoy the concept - admittedly some set up feels so relevant. I want to know the identity of your brainworms in this case. You’re clearly feeling something I feel too but you gotta give it a name for it to be sticky… something along the lines of “you know when you’re watching a good movie and you close your eyes because something feels right? You’re leaning into the sound a bit more because whether it makes sense or not the sound here is playing your emotions like a fiddle… and maybe this time around, you remember that damn fiddle and you’re tired of being played. This is a video essay about music that is abused for sounding smart. And I’m just pretentious enough to tell you how smart the music was before we neglected it’s beauty.” As for the numbering it was kind of disorienting in a good way. Like damn why should this visually be easy this is a video about music, try listening and feeling instead of just thinking. I might go further and make the fonts change to make it harder to discern the number before it melts away
Trevor Davison
2024-05-17 20:36:19 +0000 UTCI don't think I'm the target audience for this... it's interesting, but it makes me feel inferior for not even having any idea about most of these, despite having played an instrument in high school and (at least being told..) I was talented at it. Earthworm Jim was where I was first exposed to Moonlight Sonata, and I absolutely loved the song. It made me ask my parents for a synthesizer, and I learned to play it and made some of my own melodies that borrowed from it as a result. I experienced more joy from classical music as a result of that exposure in a media that I loved and was familiar with... I don't think it tore the song down, it showed me what was possible. I'm only at 6 minutes and I'm going to say that, to me at least, this is officially the bad kind of pretentious. I don't think most of the people who heard these pieces in the movies or the video game you reference stopped to think that they've heard the song too many times, or if they did recognize it they may have thought "Oh yeah I heard this in that one other movie where there was a sad scene, something sad must be about to happen". I think it's wonderful and beautiful that you made a video that means something to you, but, with an enormous amount of respect, I don't think it's for me. The video makes me feel talked down to, not educated or empowered, because I like a lot of the music you're showing and I like it in the movies it's shown in, and I think that it elevates even things like hotdog fingers intimacy without denigrating itself because it's just that powerful and classic.
Locane
2024-05-17 20:27:19 +0000 UTCYour observations are on point 👌
xanna
2024-05-17 20:22:01 +0000 UTCLOVE this. But context: I was a classical music kid.
xanna
2024-05-17 20:18:50 +0000 UTCHaven't finished watching yet, but I already love this. More concrete thoughts in edits below: Claire de Lune: all of my mental associations of this piece in film come from much older films than Everything Everywhere All At Once, particularly in a bunch of documentaries made in the '90s that I watched on PBS. It's not super clear to me that EEAAO (Gods, that acronym hurts to type) so thoroughly revolutionized the piece's context as to supercede its long history of use elsewhere, but even through that skepticism I find the idea that it might've done so delicious. Gymnopedie / Ave Maria: I would swap these rankings in a heartbeat. Ave Maria was ruined for me by its inclusion in too many Adam Sandler films I was forced to watch in grade school by substitute teachers. I still have no idea if its inclusion there was ironic or unironic or neither. But I haven't seen any films that used Satie in quite the same debauched way, & I enjoy his work too much to penalize it on the basis of works I haven't consumed. Say what you will about Cornetto, but there is *very* little room to rehabilitate ideas tried and failed by Adam Sandler. Moonlight Sonata: as a former competitive ballroom dancer, no, that is not waltz time. It's not just that it's too fast for a slow waltz and too slow for a Viennese. It's that the subtle pauses at specific phrases, along with the regular tempo changes, render the piece utterly undanceable. And if you held the pianist at gunpoint and asked them to just play the same notes in 3/4 so some undergrad could practice to it in a gym basement, it would strip away all of the musicality that makes the piece special. It would be torture. To the pianist, to the dancers, to any listeners in earshot, to whatever remains of Ludwig's syphillated corpse. No. It's so obviously 4/4 with triplets. Idk what that means for using it in film, but uh... I thought it was good in The Pianist? Cello Suite No. 1: I'm fascinated by the choice of Master & Commander (2003) as the initial example. Both in direct comparison with the far-more-recent EEAAO (still hurts but I can't help myself), and because it was chosen specifically among other cello pieces to pair with Dr. Maturin's character. Am I to gather that Bach awaits a similar revolution as occured for Debussy? If so I think there's an opportunity: in all of the history of film, there's never been a major motion picture centered around the Battle of Jutland. I think that would be the perfect opportunity to use Cello Suite No. 1 to juxtapose the film's action. Sound so beautiful & timeless, overlapping an event so singular and horrible. One might be tempted to have Hans Zimmer write a grand, sweeping, original orchestral score; but Bach would be the Hipper alternative. Prelude in E: the best video I've ever seen this used as the soundtrack for was a HazeGrayArt animation of humanity leaving Earth on hundreds of rocket ships powered by atom bombs, with the implication that we destroyed the world on our way out the door. I'm not sure I've ever seen a more appropriate pairing. I don't think I'd like to see it used anywhere else. Other ideas: The Brandenburg Concertos. Sibelius' works for piano. Rhapsody in Blue (I wanted to put Ravel here but... not as much source material). John Adams (particularly Shaker Loops). But if you wanted to post this directly to YouTube as-is, with no additional context anywhere, I think it's perfect. I love it. I would love it even more if it nucleated a genre.
John Christoph
2024-05-17 20:09:00 +0000 UTC
