confronting the CEO of Plutus
Added 2024-10-30 05:41:15 +0000 UTCagainst all odds, it finally happened. my interview with the CEO of Plutus. starts at 2:08
I asked about the 10% "CRY" (APY), 10% reward-back, as well as why their "consulting report" assumes no swaps, redemptions or selling.
To my surprise the CEO admits the platform was "built on sand".
Yet throughout our call, Plutus' CEO insisted that their new tokenomics, would solve all of this.
I couldn't quite understand how, especially since the new tokenomics offers MORE rewards, not LESS.
Magic Internet Money doesn't come from nowhere. For every reward, someone has to pay for it. Right now it appears to me that the people footing the bill are new customers who are buying "PLU" tokens to get higher reward levels. As that demand eventually falls, or the redemptions increase, this ponzi-like scheme is going to come crashing down.
Or at least that's my opinion.
highlights also include the constant waffling between them calling me a "troll" and journalist. And being damaging to the company, vs being good for PLUTUS because of the "exposure"
Back to work on bigger projects, this was a fun diversion.
Comments
Hi Coffee; I’ve been a fan a long time, but finally created a patron based on your last video just for the chance to tell you that your interview style is fantastic, and are extremely good at presenting your evidence/points so your audience can come to the same conclusion as you on their own. I work for a former prosecutor (who now does domestic violence family law cases with me), so if you ever want to talk strategy, hit me up anytime
Kyanna T.M. Dones
2024-12-06 09:21:30 +0000 UTCIt depends where you are located, as every country may (and likely does) handle it differently; however, as someone from the USA, the link to report is https://www.ic3.gov
Kyanna T.M. Dones
2024-12-06 09:13:05 +0000 UTCHow can I report a Ponzi scheme scammer I got scammed by I’m stupid 🤦
Zzz
2024-12-02 23:07:36 +0000 UTCLol might wanna have another look coffee. They promised everyone GIFT CARDS on the 30th with priority access to anyone who stacked 500 plu before then. Nobody has access bar the ambassadors and Daniels pals.
Thomas Baxter
2024-12-02 09:15:17 +0000 UTC"arguing with customers who are trying to use your service as described is never gonna be a winning strategy" GET HIM COFFEE GET HIM
MARLOW
2024-11-12 00:59:32 +0000 UTC"when you haven't done anything wrong and you're trying to do the right thing there's no questions you can be worried about" is a crazy thing to say while he's praising himself for being oh so transparent and innocent in an interview he's stuttering through trying to run all of your questions in circles and never giving a straight answer. your patience is crazy coffee mad respect
MARLOW
2024-11-12 00:37:38 +0000 UTCI had around 20 PLU I couldn't sell for fiat currency, which disappeared from existence after Plutus closed my account because I didn't choose another paid subscription in time after they jacked the price of the base plan up by 2x. Hearing the CEO stutter this much when trying to explain his business model says it all to me.
M4tZeSS
2024-11-05 18:55:06 +0000 UTCCoffee I just want to say I am in awe of your patience. I got angry just listening to this guy trying to dodge questions and try to argue that you are the presumptuous one. How are you able to keep your composure. Damn Coffee🫡
Sharky Boi
2024-11-04 04:51:17 +0000 UTCSo basically, it sounds like his solution to sustainability is that he's not saying that PLU will always hold its value, but they will always guarantee a certain value that it can be redeemed for in app. When someone redeems a reward, they take the PLU and sell it to their mysterious liquidity provider, then if (when) the amount they receive for that PLU is less than the value of the reward, they make up the difference by just charging the customer fees. This business model, therefore, is not a ponzi scheme, because instead of robbing peter to pay paul, they rob paul to pay paul! What an absolutely insane plan.
Squiggly Grehg
2024-11-03 03:29:37 +0000 UTCI'm so confused what their arrangement is with their liquidity provider. He says it doesn't cost anything to create PLU tokens, but then when customers redeem rewards they sell that PLU to their liquidity provider, who buys it "because there's already a lot out there"? It sounds like they're not buying plu from the LP because it "doesn't cost them anything", but they're selling it to this LP, who then holds onto the PLU and charges them a huge fee for the service? Am I missing something, or is there some company out there just constantly amassing tokens every time someone redeems a reward? Also I'm very curious what the, idk, net revenue per token sold is after accounting for the LP fee. Just, so many questions.
Squiggly Grehg
2024-11-03 03:08:16 +0000 UTC"once we've made it everything will be fine how can you not see that?"
Justin Collier
2024-11-01 08:50:59 +0000 UTCWhy so many schemes to get money? Sometimes you have to wonder why they work so hard to rip people off? And it's more than a little weird cause, Internet, and #coffeezilla. Feel like writing a song, Evil Men rise in the land, they were bold and conniving, until confronted by a stronger force - The power of Caffeine - channeled via a Coffeezilla!
Yourfriends AndMe
2024-11-01 00:41:03 +0000 UTCLaws. He just said that the rewards will scale to the "fuel". So it's not 10% for the highest tier: it's "whatever the 'fuel' will support for the highest tier". In other words, the rewards will be dynamic. Meaning: the rewards will probably automatically converge on something more reasonable, like 3%, but they're still promising 10% on their website.
Jackalgirl
2024-10-31 12:55:58 +0000 UTCWait a minute, super confused. At 1:08 (ish) in, he says that they buy air miles. Do they buy these air miles or don't they?
Jackalgirl
2024-10-31 12:48:07 +0000 UTCI still can't get over the idea that somehow air miles are free. That it doesn't cost an airline real money (in gas, wages, parts, fees) to fly someone from point a to point b, and so if you are going to allow a customer to fly from point a to point b and pay for this with air miles, the cost of those miles must cover the cost of flying the customer from point a to point b. Airlines do this by controlling the earned miles to the money you spend to earn them, so the system not only encourages you to fly with them, but also is sustainable. They might also sell air miles to partners at a discount, but it'll still be at a rate that ensures that they can cover the cost of their operations. If Plutus is offering air miles as a reward, the cost of the airlines' operations has to be covered somehow. The CEO seems to be saying that there are "liquidity partners" who are buying these rewards on behalf of Plutus, so Plutus actual (the company) is not paying anything for them. Well, okay, but why would they do that unless they're getting something in return on that investment? As for the sliding scale of fees: Dude, if you're using a bonding curve that increases fees/reduces the value of PLU the more you try to redeem in one shot, just say so. But this undercuts the idea that "1 PLU = 10 Pounds gift card value". If I have 1000 PLU and I want to redeem all of this at once to get 10K Pounds of gift cards, but your bonding curve/sliding scale operates at a rate that means I only get 1000 Pounds worth of gift cards, then the value is not 1 PLU = 10 Pounds: it's 1 PLU = 1 Pound (at that redemption value). Of course, I am simply throwing in numbers here because Dan has not, at this point (I'm about an hour in) committed to walking Coffee through any actual math whatsoever.
Jackalgirl
2024-10-31 12:43:44 +0000 UTCThat's one sincerely slippery CEO on the verge of tears there. And he offered to join their workgroup too, opportunity of a lifetime for sure. Cashback strictly collectable tokens - profitable and sustainable as long as never removed from the box, happy days. What's next, Ubisoft making NFT games? Owait...
Roman Olshansky
2024-10-31 06:49:23 +0000 UTC"We appreciate your tough questions". "All I asked is HOW can you pay out more than you bring in?" "I find your anger..sorry... passion, at my dodges.. inspiring"
Mike Gervasi
2024-10-31 00:16:37 +0000 UTCWhole thing irritates me. The ones claiming Dan kept his cool under your questioning. The guy was a sneeze away from a cardiac arrest. Could literally hear the sweat dripping down his face as he stumbled over his sentences.
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 23:15:42 +0000 UTCWhy would anyone buy Plu if you can’t use it
Angel Barranco
2024-10-30 22:59:27 +0000 UTCAt this point Danial can literally sit in his group of yes men and convince himself that hes not a big ponzi scammer
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 22:37:26 +0000 UTCDude talking in circles
Angel Barranco
2024-10-30 22:37:22 +0000 UTCKurtis Dunphy @KurtisDunphy · 1h I have always respected Coffeezilla, so I was sad to see his recent upload. Whilst I appreciate his concerns, I believe he is failing to differentiate between a cash-back model and the reward-based tokenomics Plutus is developing. Danial Daychopan @DDhopn · 49m I've seen his post on Tether. I believe he means well and don’t blame him for getting it wrong—he’s had only four days and an angry mob feeding him misinformation.
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 22:36:49 +0000 UTCThis just shows how much of an arrogant pos dan is tho. He's now making sure the narrative is that u are a troll and deliberately attacked him for views. His brainwashed saying you should apologies lol. I am so out.
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 22:35:40 +0000 UTCLmao Dan now calling u a troll
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 22:34:46 +0000 UTC✨ P A S S I O N A T E ✨
Tom Walkinshaw
2024-10-30 19:45:14 +0000 UTCCoffee, I just wanted to appreciate how passionate you are. It's great that you're coming on to ask the hard questions and give them exposure. Did I mention it's great how passionate you are?
SkepticGhost
2024-10-30 18:32:48 +0000 UTCCoffee "passion" zilla
Shawn Sanchez
2024-10-30 17:58:09 +0000 UTCI truly admire your ability to stay on topic and actually sit through so much rambling/bullshit and still hammer in the actual point you're trying to make. My ADHD would have me looking at something else or distracted by all the nonsense being spewed haha
Shawn Sanchez
2024-10-30 17:55:45 +0000 UTCWhat u won't have heard about is their idea to move to a new blockchain with an unlimited supply SORRY not unlimited. That's fud. DYNAMIC supply lol. Cant make this up.
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 16:58:16 +0000 UTCIm just glad i smelled a rat months ago and sold all my plu. I raised a chargeback for my subscription but suddenly plutus support decided to refund me so all im out is the 100 pending plu. I've made a tidy profit off it but time to move on as the pyramid is gonna collapse.
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 16:57:17 +0000 UTCI think the moment that blew my mind was when you said it wasn't sustainable and he defended it with "you're right it isn't"
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 16:56:03 +0000 UTCThey’re guaranteeing a value of 10£/PLU which makes no sense as presently they’re rewarding people in PLU at a price of £2/PLU. So there’s an easy arbitrage.
Coffeezilla
2024-10-30 16:14:10 +0000 UTCEven more strange the tax is on 3rd party blockchain transactions which now they discourage— previously you could send PLU token to outside exchanges to sell. Now they say this behavior is not acceptable. So you’d logically assume 3rd party transactions would fall-> meaning less tax revenue????
Coffeezilla
2024-10-30 16:12:12 +0000 UTCCoffee speaks with a normal voice Daniel and his team: Coffee stop speaking so passionately. We can't think through your intelligence and logic.
Lil_Ellie
2024-10-30 16:04:09 +0000 UTCThey initially said they’d require an NDA to see it. Later they said they wouldnt, but I’m guessing they’d come up with someway to prevent me from commenting on it.
Coffeezilla
2024-10-30 15:43:34 +0000 UTCThey want to sustain a 10% cashback with a 5% fee?
Mario Ojeda
2024-10-30 14:01:55 +0000 UTCThe amount of time he says that the token doesn't cost them anything just has this huge "oh no. Oh noooooo" energy to it. It's like. My dude. You are saying that your token has no value when you say that. Minting it might not cost, but every one you add, you devalue the rest. Plus, each token is functionally an IOU. People will want something for it....
Fran B
2024-10-30 13:39:27 +0000 UTCAlso, presenting the idea that customers who might want to do something with their tokens -- the tokens that the company has specifically marketed to them as "rewards" -- are demonstrating an "entitlement attitude" that needs to be corrected, is kind of breathtakingly bold. "I've promised you free money for using my system, but how very dare you want me to actually give you that money."
Jackalgirl
2024-10-30 13:36:56 +0000 UTCIf your unique system can be brought to its knees by only 800 customers out of a claimed 125K active users (about 0.645% of users), perhaps your system might be a tad bit brittle.
Jackalgirl
2024-10-30 13:32:52 +0000 UTCnot ask for a spreadsheet of the so called financial model? if there so called model exists there must be a spreadsheet. spreadsheet or it does not exist
Sebastian Wagner
2024-10-30 13:18:18 +0000 UTCI cant believe that there are still s!tt coin projects out there ! Does people learn ? lol
Francois Veilleux
2024-10-30 12:10:46 +0000 UTCAre you still planning to put something out to a wider audience on this?
lulu Gregory
2024-10-30 10:48:25 +0000 UTCThere was an twitter AMA on the 7th of July about the whitepaper, hopefully someone still has the audio, in it Sean Sessel (Independent Financial Modeller) , the consultant Plutus hired to battle proof the model said that he didn't test the model with the yearly multiplier and that this was added to the Whitepaper without his knowledge. Maybe another lead in case you wanna follow up with model questions.
Silva
2024-10-30 10:40:06 +0000 UTCThis is such a painful conversation he is sooo slippery. Clearly basic mathematics dictates that you can’t keep creating money at the rate they are projecting. Hate the “Thanks for the exposure” comments like it’s beneficial to them. Straight up scam!
Greg
2024-10-30 10:06:49 +0000 UTCI listened to the live speech and the CEO's arguments were ridiculous. He tried so hard to give non-answers.
GreenSwede
2024-10-30 09:50:10 +0000 UTCI used to work for a CFO of a company and this guy talks almost exactly how he did. He would say a lot of financial sounding things, and it could tell a story/narrative. But as soon as you try to tie it back to the original question, it doesn’t make sense or doesn’t even match the context.
Justin Schober
2024-10-30 09:34:12 +0000 UTCThe reason the plutusmiles etc will work i reckon will be because they will mark them up to the moon. £1000 holiday will cost £3000 in plu.
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 09:10:36 +0000 UTCThe fact Danial sounds like hes gonna burst into tears
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 09:03:05 +0000 UTCYou got me as a patreon now. This is exactly what needed to be said and finally everyone can see how much shit this guy chats
Thomas Baxter
2024-10-30 09:02:28 +0000 UTCI am at 18:50 and this dude repeatingly lying. He just said you can withdraw and it is sent within 24 hours. Thats a lie and everyone knows that. You can even check in on chain. The rewards payout wallet sometimes isnt topped up for days or even weeks. So you can see on chain that there are no rewards payed out. For example, I can not withdraw at the moment because I breached the ToS. But basically I did exactly what Coffee said: I used the cashback / rewards card for what it is => GETTING CASHBACK / REWARDS! In the last months I withdrew my rewards once per month to metamask and sent it to an exchange afterwards. And because of that I am a violator in their eyes. It is basically the ONLY THING you could do with the rewards for a year. Or you could just leave the rewards on the Plutus platform (and dont own them) and what how the price of PLU keeps dumping. Which basically reduces your cashback rate even further.... This guy is a notorious liar. Also the numbers he keeps spitting out are fake. There are no 125k active customers. His "small" group of violators (bad people who abuse his ecosystem) isnt small, its basically almost everybody. And also the whitepaper vote of which he claims was approved by majority of the users (57%?) is also fake. They wanted to do the vote on blockchain but then decided to no to. Guess why? Because you would have seen that 90% voted against their WP. This is pure comedy. I am extremely grateful that people like Coffeezilla exist. Otherwise we would have no power to fight against this type of scammers.
espresso
2024-10-30 08:22:31 +0000 UTC😂😂😂
Nadja Niegel
2024-10-30 08:21:01 +0000 UTCCoffee, you’re the best. Happy to support you!
Fernanda Alario
2024-10-30 07:57:32 +0000 UTCLike watching a man try to grab a snake that's covered in butter, while that snake claims not to be a snake that's covered in butter, while the snake's friend looks on and also claims that the snake is not a snake that's covered in butter.
Manuel Cards
2024-10-30 07:34:58 +0000 UTCManaged to watch half of it so far, isn’t the problem that he’s saying internally they peg one token at a price of £10 but in the real world they sell for circa £1.50p Internally pegged prices mean nothing, it’s external market value prices which is the true reward return, right ? Why does he keep mentioning your passion 🤣
Gary Woodhead
2024-10-30 07:34:15 +0000 UTCThis man keeps running around a basic fact: for a system to be sustainable the money that comes in must be at least equal to the money that comes out. He sounds so stressed, the ponzi scheme must be runnng out of fresh money.
KraKrathedamned
2024-10-30 07:32:05 +0000 UTCIf you don't understand where the yield is coming from then you are the yield Unless there is an actual real world utility then it's 99.99% a scam or built on sand Bitcoin is different as its the store of value attracting capital from other more inferior store of value assets, but the rest of crypto 99.9999% of them will fail
Brian Fenech
2024-10-30 07:17:50 +0000 UTCI haven’t watched this yet (need sleep) but imagine being a diversion for Coffeezilla. 👀
V L
2024-10-30 06:01:53 +0000 UTCCoffee the goat! 🐐🔥
Always Marco
2024-10-30 05:44:33 +0000 UTC
