The Sopranos 2x10 Reaction
Added 2024-11-01 01:04:54 +0000 UTC
Comments
If we analyze Tony and try to diagnose him with one of the two, he would definitely be a sociopath and not a psychopath. The differences between sociopathy and psychopathy are often debated, but those are some general known characteristics that can differentiate them: Causes: Sociopathy: Usually associated with environmental factors, like childhood trauma or negative social experiences. Sociopathy is believed to be more influenced by social context (It also depends on genetics, but growing up in a bad environment is the main factor that makes someone become a sociopath in adulthood. A person who has genetics that could make them a sociopath, but who grew up in a good environment, will most likely grow up to be a normal adult capable of feeling empathy in a normal way). Psychopathy: Related to biological and genetic characteristics only. As far as I know, they are born that way (it don't matter what kind of environment they will grow up and live). Empathy: Sociopaths: May have some capacity for distorted empathy, which can lead to moments of regret or guilt, especially when their actions affect close individuals. Psychopaths: Generally lack empathy entirely. They don't feel any remorse or guilt for their actions. Social Behavior: Sociopaths: They are often more impulsive and prone to erratic and emotional behavior. Psychopaths: More manipulative and calculating. They tend to be colder and more rational in their interactions, we usually don't see them feeling very strong emotions. Tony demonstrates the ability to form emotional connections with his family and some of his friends, even though these relationships are complicated. He shows moments of vulnerability and genuine concern for those close to him, which is more typical of sociopaths. He shows impulsive and emotional behaviors, often reacting intensely to stressful or challenging situations, again more aligned with sociopaths. On some occasions, we see Tony expressing some kind of remorse or guilt for his actions, most of the time when it affect his family. This capacity to feel some kind of guilt under certain circumstances is a characteristic possible only for sociopaths (since psychopaths lack this completely as far as i know). Also, The show explores Tony's past, including childhood traumas and family issues that shaped his behavior (As you guys have already noticed several times), this also suggest that Tony would be a sociopath and not psychopsth (If we were to diagnose him as either of the two), because of the significant environmental influence.
Floweyyyy
2024-11-03 10:51:56 +0000 UTCShe’s the heroine of every scene she’s in 🙏
space colon
2024-11-01 23:17:16 +0000 UTCOutside of the actual Sopranos, Chrissy has my favorite storyline even though solely as a character I prefer Paulie.
snaps
2024-11-01 21:07:47 +0000 UTC"Heroine" abuse is an excellent typo considering the relationship between Chrissy & Aide. Well played!
snaps
2024-11-01 21:04:46 +0000 UTCHe did seem to legitimately forget about the swim meet. He was at his lawyer's office. Lots on his mind. He hadn't been the same person all week. To me, Tony didn't seem to fake his realization of missing the event. I believe he was justifying it, after the fact.
Isaac
2024-11-01 21:04:37 +0000 UTCFor many people watching characters, it depends on where the corruption occurs. The idea behind empathizing is to immerse yourself in the character's perspective and then determine "How close am I to making those same decisions in context? Can I understand why they did things this way?" In that case, I imagine it would take extreme effort to find enjoyment, if the character participates in emotional abuse, sexual violence, or the harm of children. Of course, when there are many other aspects to hook into(and LM do), there's no problem. Milena & Lola have understandable issues when characters move into these more disgusting territories
Isaac
2024-11-01 21:01:59 +0000 UTCFrom my view, it's more of the fact that Carmela does not have a solid outlet for positive change. Religion and household stability keep her shackled in a marriage she wants less and less, each day. She has committed herself to be an accessory to a criminal enterprise. There aren't many avenues that take care of Carmela, the person, that don't damage the things around her. Of all the things she could do to fight for her own needs, cheating on the spouse that has consistently cheated on her is the most realistic option that rocks the boat the least.
Isaac
2024-11-01 20:47:29 +0000 UTCDid you watch the part when they discuss that she's a willing participant and knew exacrly what she was signing up for when she married Tony?
Michael M
2024-11-01 20:29:16 +0000 UTCBut didn't they already acknowledge that about Carmela in this very reaction?
enchantertim
2024-11-01 20:24:45 +0000 UTCI normally enjoy your reactions and takes, but this one felt a little off the mark especially when it comes to Tony and Carmela. You guys are severely discounting the fact that Carmela knew exactly what she was signing up for when she married Tony. It's like you ignore how much Carmela loves the lifestyle he provides. My only ask is that in the future you remember that she is a willing participant even if she doesn't know exactly how evil he might be. That is the entire main characteristic of her character.
Edward Lewis
2024-11-01 20:14:26 +0000 UTCI mean I look at him and see a victim of abuse and emotional neglect, those things define his life the same way they do Tony. Chris is a beaten emotionally crippled dog Tony is Frankenstein and Chris is Frankenstein’s monster trying to navigate the world without guidance or love from a parent He really tries to engage with his passions despite everything and he really did want to help Adriana fulfill her dreams of producing for a band. We see him follow Tony around out of concern and consistently show abject loyalty to him and the family We don’t see him become violent towards Adriana until he starts abusing drugs, which began after he saw that Tony will look out for his own Mental health but not his He’s become more and more unhinged since his best friend was killed and he was dragged to the mock execution. His Heroine abuse in Italy is horrifying to watch, he wanted to see the country and bring back authentic gifts for Adriana but his addiction has stifled any level of emotional healing Ziggy from The Wire is a great comparison, he didn’t do a lot to warrant affection but it was very clear his upbringing ruined him
space colon
2024-11-01 19:03:54 +0000 UTC2 wrongs don't make a right, Carmella being unfaithful is also bad just like when Tony does it imo. It's interesting tho as a man, it kind of upset me bc i see her as a more pure moral person that's a great wife/mother...but you guys were cheering for it as women and for her to be equal to tony haha. Not making any judgment, just dif perspectives haha wonder how other male/female watchers felt about it.
Tyler Scott
2024-11-01 17:54:09 +0000 UTCHonestly, the more I think about it, the more I see that Tony is just replicating Johnny Boy's attitude towards him and Janice since that's what he knew as fatherly love growing up (favoring the daughter, wanting his son to "toughen" up).
IanJ
2024-11-01 16:42:51 +0000 UTCwtf
Wallas
2024-11-01 15:06:26 +0000 UTCok? he's a child, Tony holds absolute power over him.
Dani
2024-11-01 15:03:52 +0000 UTCTony was way out of line with his AJ "male heir" insult but AJ is not this innocent baby you make him out to be. He's smoking pot and stealing cars at around 12 years old
mrjackpotz
2024-11-01 14:50:29 +0000 UTCMuch like Tywin, the performance really makes it so good. James Gandolfini's performance through this show is just so good IMO.
Scott S
2024-11-01 14:04:18 +0000 UTCDoes it make you enjoy the show less when Tony becomes more morally corrupt? Not being able to root for the protagonist can sometimes turn people off. Personally, I find it entertaining, regardless of his ethical downturn. It’s like watching Tywin in game of thrones. You’re watching pure evil, but for me at least it doesn’t make the show less entertaining or difficult to get behind
windyMelon
2024-11-01 12:38:39 +0000 UTCIn regards to Chris, liking a lot of the characters in this show is sort of preceded by the knowledge that they're very flawed, often bad people. Tony and Chris are more like Avon and Bodie from The Wire than Walter White and Jessie from Breaking Bad, in the sense that they were born into the game. I think that's what keeps them there as much as anything else, regardless of how many opportunities they have to leave. The tradition, the community, the family, the fact that it's all they've ever known. Tony pushes away his doubts because if he let them in, his entire life and sense of self would crumble away. It would all be a big nothing. I find Tony and Chris relatable even though their circumstances are not in any real way acceptable.
Mark M
2024-11-01 10:23:31 +0000 UTCYeah it seems pretty clear tragedy alone isn't producing the warmth they're talking about for them. He might become more interesting, but their reaction is already pretty telling.
Veya
2024-11-01 07:32:04 +0000 UTCIdk if I'd tell them that... but I do think that up till now there's been plenty of reason to have empathy for Chris, at least if you're able to have empathy toward Tony Seeing him holding another man’s leg whining “DADDY DADDY” hurt my soul (in no world should Adriana have to endure any level of abuse, I understand if people struggle to care about Chris because of his domestic abuse. I just hope they can appreciate the nuance of Michael Imperioli’s performance)
space colon
2024-11-01 07:05:47 +0000 UTC@the choosen one He forgot about his kids swim meet because he was literally dealing with the prospect of GOING TO PRISON. We saw a scene of him going to that finance guy about nest money around the same time of the swim meet. I don't think this was brought up in their discussion as well but it's not exactly a small thing. We have seen him spent time with AJ plenty of times across both seasons. Melfi even calls him out here: Tony: "It was always, "We'll do this." "We're gonna do that." Melfi: "I've heard you talk many times about being with your son." This is just reinforcing that I think he's being judged too harshly because the negatives are being remembered more than the positives. And the book thing and the college remark just seems so light.
Veya
2024-11-01 06:30:58 +0000 UTCThe "It's America" comment for the starter's pistol in the race in the race is crazy, lol.🤣They use it for swimming and track meets worldwide pretty much. Shoots blanks or is connected to an audio device usually. The show definitely was making a point with that transition, though.
mbds
2024-11-01 06:16:09 +0000 UTCSociopath and psychopath aren’t actual things people are diagnosed with. They both are used to describe people with Anti social personality disorder which Tony has definitely developed throughout his life. Most people think developing it is a mix of genetic and social conditions.
the chosen one
2024-11-01 06:06:39 +0000 UTCYou may have a good point about Livia, but she is deranged, if not evil.
Clay F
2024-11-01 06:05:25 +0000 UTCYeah, you can definitely tell that Tony cares about AJ. It's not easy being a parent, especially when you have a demanding or stressful job. My daughter is 28 and my son is 25.
Clay F
2024-11-01 06:02:59 +0000 UTCMy dumbass saw her real name (Aida Torturro) and thought to my self "hmmm, sounds familiar" and never following it up lol
IanJ
2024-11-01 05:50:06 +0000 UTCIt's funny how Tony is as terrified of that civilian witness as he is of Tony. As a matter of fact, I don't think we've ever seen Tony as scared as he is in this episode. Reminds me of that adage about how the only way for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing. In a perfect world, that witness doesn't have to be afraid of any repercussions from the Mafia and can rightly send Tony to jail. So far, Tony in this episode is him at his most self-pitying. Telling Melfi that he could be going away for a long time for "something he didn't do", telling her that he didn't deserve any of this. The idea that he might have to face the consequence of his actions is terrifying for him. The scene later when he's drinking in the dark with Meadow asking if she knows that he loves her, in my interpretation, is something to give himself a peace of mind. Tony tries to bond with AJ, asking him to go see a movie with him. Season 1 AJ would love to do that with Tony, but now that ship has sailed. Later, Tony also rejects AJ in the therapy session. Like a little child, he gets back at AJ by skipping AJ's last race of the season and laughs it off when Carmela confronted him about it. But in the end, Tony did get some bonding moment with AJ. It's interesting how both episodes involving Davey Scatino ends with Tony and his children, with Meadow getting her solo performance because of the trouble wrought upon the Scatinos from Tony. Here we see the two of them capsizing a boat even when the people on it kept shouting at them to stop, not a care in the world. Davey's character is a microcosm of how Tony and the mob interacts with normal people, thriving on the misfortune of others.
IanJ
2024-11-01 05:38:41 +0000 UTCTony is not just a “clumsy” parent. He is an awful one. He forgot about his kids swim meet then when confronted about it basically said that’s what AJ gets for not wanting to go to the movies with him. When he told him to crack down on the books it was right after telling him he’ll never get into the school he wants. Tony shows much warmer feelings towards meadow. Even in this episode. When he talks to her it’s soft and kind. The way you do to a child. When he talks to AJ it’s almost always screaming and berating him. He called him a disappointment and as much as he can apologize it’s how he sees him.
the chosen one
2024-11-01 05:37:40 +0000 UTCincredible show, incredible reaction
Nazım Metin
2024-11-01 05:37:21 +0000 UTCIt’s funny because Tony’s love for his children is one of his only redeeming qualities when it’s all said and done imo. Especially his relationship with meadow.
Johnny Bxb
2024-11-01 04:58:05 +0000 UTCAlso I think Tony's parenting is being judge a bit harshly. Tony tries A LOT harder with his kids than Walt. Like, it's not particularly close. There are times I forget Walt even had kids in Breaking Bad because he spends so little time with them and there's less warmth and internal turmoil about it. Tony is just a clumsy parent but we can see how wounded he is when Carmella implied (in his head at least) that he doesn't care about them enough that he's sitting alone in the dark drinking. Also, we're literally getting more reminders this episode that his OWN family tries to kill him. We already see in an earlier episode that despite him saying his own mom is dead to him, he still teaches AJ to love and respect his mother. He literally told AJ he needs to "crack the books" and has openly stated he doesn't want AJ down the path that Tony himself is in, in the first season episode where we saw his childhood and in this episode again. Also they didn't see the people on the boat at the end. That was Chase's cheeky way of reflecting another through-line in the show.
Veya
2024-11-01 04:16:02 +0000 UTCSopranos has always been the highest standard of capturing human complexity on the screen. It’s eternally relevant. Just keeps getting better as the seasons go.
JayFi
2024-11-01 04:07:25 +0000 UTCYou guys will love Chris. Give it time his story has barely started.
the chosen one
2024-11-01 04:03:14 +0000 UTCThe way Tony's guilt is dealt with is one of the most realistic portrayals of that part of human nature. It's not a "TV arc" type of way of showing it like a continuous stream that builds a traditional arc. It comes and goes like in real life. How many people in real life claim to care about social issues or care about animals or talk about complicity in a variety of things in society, and then don't change their actions and rationalize it away. How many do the bare minimum and then pat themselves on the back and continue on? It also helps that Tony's life is chaotic enough that it affords him more distractions from real self-reflection which is why the therapy sessions are crucial for any potential for him to change and it's concerning that he has a difficult relationship with it and Melfi is running into stopgaps in their sessions due to his personality. Also, in terms of what weighs or doesn't on a character's mind, I'd say keep an open mind about that. For how minimalist the show's plot is, the psychology and themes aren't.
Veya
2024-11-01 04:03:13 +0000 UTC“I find powerful men erotic” Janice is attracted to Richie in part because his behavior mirrors her father, Freudian subtext is there throughout the season. Her feeling of entitlement over the mob isn’t much different than Tony’s Wish all the main characters had therapy scenes
space colon
2024-11-01 03:51:40 +0000 UTCChris is definitely one of people's favorite characters. I think his character is problematic when trying to judge him out of context. You have to look at the world he was born into. Also the acting performance is top notch.
Farbod
2024-11-01 03:45:01 +0000 UTCA certain comment they made in the end discussion (iykyk) made me chuckle
a. tree
2024-11-01 02:32:26 +0000 UTCYeah ‘Con Te Partiro’ pretty much becomes the leitmotif for Carmela’s domestic misery they play it a lot. As generally joyless as Livia is I always contend that I do think part of her genuinely loves her grandchildren if nothing else, they’re the scenes she most often comes across like a functioning human being. Tony has certainly done ‘worse’ things already, and absolutely will do much worse things in future, but I’ve always been particularly struck by how dark it is how he is able to so breezily and matter-of-factly admit to Davey that he preyed on him, knowingly, and seems affronted at the idea that he even did anything worth crying about - he has to make a living what is he just not gonna ruin your life to make sure he can keep buying boats?!
Jay Craig
2024-11-01 02:30:42 +0000 UTC"Everything I do ...". It often feels like Sopranos isn't just inspiration for many future shows, but some scenes really seem like another writer saw that and said "I'm gonna make a show about that!". (... e.g. Chris going to the theater class becomes Barry)
Nick P
2024-11-01 02:27:39 +0000 UTCJa-neece and Irwing?!
Jay Craig
2024-11-01 01:19:35 +0000 UTCoh, really, that is a fun fact indeed. i was 100% sure christopher walken was going to be a secondary character and was looking forward to them seeing him and then realised i was getting him confused with steve buscemi lol i've never watched the show but me and my roomates in college watched a lot of top 10 mojo videos so i know some pretty big spoilers about it. still can't believe i mixed christopher and steven when i love both actors.
sand_fl
2024-11-01 01:15:15 +0000 UTCFun fact, "Janice" and "Irving" from Severance are cousins :D
Isaac
2024-11-01 01:07:58 +0000 UTC
