Movie Watcher Reads Harry Potter For the First Time! - Prisoner of Azkaban Chapters 18 & 19!
Added 2023-05-24 13:01:19 +0000 UTCHi guys! You will never guess what...
🎉 I start the video offf with an apology!! 🎉
So I misinterpreted something in these chapters, but luckily, you are all there to correct me in the Book Club!
We have a good and frank discussion about Snape, Black and the Marauders in general, as well as doing the usual indepth discussion on everything else!
Poor Hermione... I have a right go at her for no reason at one point. XD
Love you, guys! WHAT a pair of chapters!!
Comments
Ron claiming Scabbers lives 12 years because they took good care of him is ridiculous. A rat who gets the absolute best care won't live more than 2-3 years max. I work at a vet and honestly I've never seen a rat make it to 3 years. One of my colleagues had a bunch of them and they all died around 2-2.5 years old.
Maggie
2023-06-27 03:17:04 +0000 UTCI don't think that Hermione thought it was a joke at all, but she was well aware that Sirius (at least at the time) thought it was. More than that, she knew that Snape knew that Sirius (and James too, in Snape's view) thought it was a joke. She wasn't stating her own opinion here; she was pointing out what Snape believed the Marauders' opinion was. It's not, "Wasn't that a funny joke, and by the way, did Snape think James was part of it?" Not at all. It was more like, "How awful that Snape thought James was in on the horrible murder attempt that Sirius clearly thought was hilarious!" Hermione isn't being excessively pro-Marauder; she's trying to be very balanced and logical, and see things from everyone's point of view at once. In particular, she's recognizing James's point of view, as the one who risked his life to stop it as soon as he heard about it, and Snape's point of view, as the one who narrowly escaped death at the hands of two of Marauders (even if Remus honestly couldn't help his part in it, Snape would never fully acknowledge that) and assumed that the Marauder leader was also involved in the plan. Cut Hermione some slack here; she's just trying to sort out the information, as usual. Oh! As soon as I posted this, I went back to listening, and you corrected it from Hermione to Harry. Oops, I should have caught that. But my point still stands: neither Harry when he said it, nor Snape when he agreed with it, actually thought it was a joke. Both of them simply meant that Snape believed that Sirius saw it as a joke, which was obviously true. That's all. Nothing to get upset with Harry about.
Christina Brock
2023-06-04 22:54:46 +0000 UTCI'm glad I made you laugh, Monique :) To be honest, I'd never ever thought about any of that until I read Frederique's comment. That's why I love the book club, it makes me see some of the characters in a different way or perspective.
Janie
2023-05-31 05:48:56 +0000 UTCIt really is an interesting topic to ponder!
Monique
2023-05-30 21:01:00 +0000 UTC@Janie - I legitimately laughed out loud when I read, "But maybe it just means I'm even more paranoid than Voldemort :)" I think that's what made this entire exchange so interesting. Something i haven't pondered deeply so your point is so valid. Why wasn't he more suspicious? I think not knowing the answer to that leaves so much up to the impression people have of Snape. Appreciate the fun back and forth ont his
Monique
2023-05-30 21:00:16 +0000 UTCAs a woman who works in the construction industry, I concur heartily about the sexist jokes but then I realized long ago they make those jokes for their male friends, not for me so I'm just a tool they use to get a laugh. Says more about them than about me so...
Monique
2023-05-30 20:48:41 +0000 UTCActually I think, that you are saying strong opinions not necessarily because that's how book is written, but because you saw the movies. The problem is, that movies distorted, changed, ruined a lot of characters, so yes, there is a lot of context you are missing ;) Can't say anything else without spoilers ;) I always try to spread your 2h of talking (I don't stay for book club, some opinions are just too blood boiling and I listen your videos to relax xD) for few days, so waiting for next video feels shorter, that's why I comment quite late ;)
Mordimer
2023-05-29 23:49:18 +0000 UTCAs a female gamer who plays a fairly heavy male dominated game, I'm often on the receiving end of many sexist jokes. I can tell you, I never find them funny. Jokes will only be funny to those that find humor in the same thing. Same can be said for pranks. Obviously the one pulling the prank will find it hilarious, but the person it is happening to, most likely won't.
Kunzite Blossom
2023-05-29 19:47:26 +0000 UTCI always found it kind of fascinating, when Snape asks Bellatrix in HBP if she thinks he would be here, if he had not been able to have satisfying answers to each and every of Voldemorts questions. I have never really soend tomexwondering what might have occured, when he returned two hours or so later.
Dara Jeeling
2023-05-28 20:59:30 +0000 UTC100% itsadancething! A *good* prank should be funny for everyone, but there are sooo many examples of pranks where the definition of 'funny' is stretched even for the audience (hence why a lot of prank YouTubers get cancelled when they go too far!). 'In on the joke' is definitely a bad term of phrase but in the moment I reckon it's an understandable semantic mistake for Harry to make.
Jake M
2023-05-28 15:23:31 +0000 UTCYeah, it is kind of a figure of speech. I think "in on the plan" would have been better verbiage, but oh well! And not all jokes or pranks (in my opinion) are meant to make the person they're played on laugh. The "victim" (terrible word, but best in this situation I guess) often doesn't find it funny at all.
itsanursething
2023-05-28 02:13:28 +0000 UTCI am not a native english speaker but isn't 'to be in on the joke' a kind of saying that can be used even if it is not a literal joke? I don't think it necessarily implies that this is a joke for Harry. Also Snape himself calls it a joke in an earlier chapter when he catches Harry with the Marauder's Map. So i think its unfair to blame Harry for using this word.
Starryk
2023-05-28 00:14:14 +0000 UTCI think one reason why Sirius (Mr. Black) would suggest and the Potters would have gone with Peter even though Sirius would have died rather than betray them is because at the time, Sirius trusted Peter absolutely. So did James. Sirius now sees Peter as contemptible and weak after 12 years of stewing in Azkaban thinking about everything bad he ever did. But Peter was a real part of this incredibly close group of friends. That's what makes his betrayal so sad in the end. Someone has probably said above or maybe it got clearer during the reaction, but just in case: Animagi are not born. Becoming an animagus is a super complicated, long process of advanced transfiguration. It's not illegal to become one, but it is illegal not to register that you become one. McGonagall registered with the Ministry, but James, Sirius, and Peter did it in secret. "In on the joke" I feel like Harry (like others using similar language) is speaking to how Snape perceives the Marauders' attitudes more than expressing his own bias, but yeah it's definitely not a joke. It's just easier to call it that than to look too deeply and name it something else.
Q
2023-05-27 22:54:50 +0000 UTCVery good point. It makes me wonder how Voldemort and Snapes interaction was when Snape went back. Maybe Voldemort only completely trusted Snape after he killed Dumbledore.
Karen
2023-05-27 12:18:26 +0000 UTCYou both have a point about Voldemort not understanding love. But still, he seems to be very paranoid. I would think that he would be at least a little suspicious of Snape, considering that Snape had spent 13 years around Dumbledore. Yes, being the best Occlumens alive might help Snape to convince him, but if I were Voldemort I still wouldn't trust him completely. But maybe it just means I'm even more paranoid than Voldemort :)
Janie
2023-05-27 11:56:04 +0000 UTC@Janie Voldemort does not and cannot understand love. He simply thought Snape desired Lily. Snape is probably the most accomplished Occlumens alive. Because Voldemort is the world's best Legilimens and doesn't ever penetrate Snape's mind.
S1lm4r1l
2023-05-27 11:11:04 +0000 UTC@Janie, I wonder if Voldemort just missed it completely because of his inability to love others. I know that love being a particular blind spot for Voldemort was a recurring theme. Maybe he just didn't even recognize Snapes feelings for what they were when he pleaded for just her and assumed it was misguided loyalty left over for a childhood friend? It's a bit of a fascinating thought experiment though to explore this!
Monique
2023-05-27 01:11:26 +0000 UTCIt was Sirius, not Lupin, who called Ron "boy"! 😅
emmainkeri
2023-05-26 22:45:30 +0000 UTCI believe Snape disliked James for the way he was, not only because James fancied Lily. That just made him dislike and despise James more.
emmainkeri
2023-05-26 22:11:53 +0000 UTCFascinating! I never even thought of that! I think mostly though, it's that people associate werewolves with people like Greenback, so they don't think any of them are good people and are too afraid to hire them. Which completely breaks my heart!
itsanursething
2023-05-26 21:19:44 +0000 UTCThis is so interesting! I've never even thought about that. But you're right, Snape must have been very close to Voldemort in the first war for Voldemort to welcome him back so easily. But I wonder why Voldemort wasn't more suspicious of Snape, especially when Snape begged him to spare Lily's life. Either Snape was really that good at Occlumency, or Voldemort just underestimated him and his feelings for Lily. Or both.
Janie
2023-05-26 19:54:48 +0000 UTCOh, for sure on Bellatrix. She is so very resentful of Snape. I also assumed the death eaters all got tortured a little as punishment and so assumed Snape would as well but perhaps a bit more for being in Dumbledore's orbit for so long. That said, we see Dumbledore acknowledge that Snape was a death eater but had turned spy for them in GOF when we see his memory of Karkarov snitching in court so Voldemort must have either believed Snape to be a double agent for him already. Or maybe that was the reason Snape gave for being so tight with Dumbledore while Voldemort was in exile. "I was keeping an eye on our enemies for when you eventually returned' sort of thing. So great to find a thread I have never pondered in all the years of reading these.
Monique
2023-05-26 19:13:46 +0000 UTCLupin does look ill in the days prior and after his transformation. So there's probably 3-4 days every month when he's less than 100% Kinda understandable why most employers wouldn't want to deal with his disability. Especially given the lack of Worker's Rights in the Wizarding World. And that's before you even get to the stigma of Lycanthropy.
S1lm4r1l
2023-05-26 18:38:23 +0000 UTCI always assumed that Lupin couldn’t find work because of the limitations he would have as an employee. Not as a prejudice against him being a werewolf. He would need a significant amount of time off build onto his schedule every month due to his transformations with each full moon. It would he extremely difficult for an employer to accommodate such a schedule. Just something to consider…
Helen
2023-05-26 18:28:20 +0000 UTC@Karen I'm pretty sure they say its the 7th year they get together, which makes sense given they're Head Boy and Girl.
S1lm4r1l
2023-05-26 18:03:12 +0000 UTC@Monique From what we see, most of the other 'traitorous' Death Eaters aren't tortured or otherwise killed by Voldemort upon his return. I've always assumed that Voldemort did Cruciate all of them a little, because of their disloyalty and his anger at letting Harry slip through his fingers again. Bellatrix being envious of Snape's access to Voldemort and the position of confidence he enjoys is a central reason why she distrusts him.
S1lm4r1l
2023-05-26 18:02:13 +0000 UTCGreat point I wasn’t even thinking about how Snape was welcomed back so easily. I was mainly thinking about how after Snape calls Lilly a Mudblood and he waits outside Gryffindor common room Lilly points out he can’t wait to become a death eater and his friends too. He doesn’t deny this at all. I know that the “prank” is before SWM but from what I searched it’s the same school year. I also will say I think the “prank” is the start of the turning point for James not being an arrogant toe rag and leading Lily to dating him later on. (I forget if they start dating 6th or 7th year)
Karen
2023-05-26 15:53:59 +0000 UTCMr. Black, I’m glad you are enjoying the books. They were a big part of my life growing up and I find going back and rereading them to be a lovely time. It’s funny that you mentioned how it must have been something reading such a big book at 8/9 years old. POA is considered a 7th grade level book and I was in 4th grade so it was considered impressive to my teachers. Especially considering I almost failed a previous grade because I couldn’t read. I’m 30 now and I’m not sure if dyslexia was commonly known about when I was in elementary school but I do know they were worried that I wouldn’t be able to learn and I couldn’t read until a week before my cutoff date. I don’t have dyslexia, however I struggle to focus so in order to read I sometimes have to use a blank paper to block the lower sentences because they tend to distract me. The book club helps me to take my time and notice things I didn’t before, as well as get different perspectives. My son is currently on book five and I get so happy when he runs into the room to ask me if I knew about something that happened in the books. He has the illustrated versions of books 1-5. Give Woozel (I hope I spelled that right) a scritch for me.
Kattie Martin
2023-05-26 15:44:36 +0000 UTCWhat an interesting thought and idea to explore! I had never thought of that. Also spoilery, I always appreciated the scene in GOF where you know Dumbledore is sending Snape back to Voldemort for the first time and asks him if he's ready. How Harry notes Snape looks more scared than he's ever seen him, or something to that effect. I always assumed it was a reintroduction that Snape would suffer through in some way for his position at Dumbledore's school. Perhaps his position did afford him a smooth reintroduction to his position in the Death Eaters.
Monique
2023-05-26 15:27:55 +0000 UTCYou and I are very much on the same page here. Since I am replying it to you and not addressing Veggie directly, I will get spoilery. So if anyone else is reading this and doesn't want to get spoiled, this is your warning!!! To me, the way Voldemort welcomes back Snape tells me everything you need to know about what Snape was like right until the moment he realized Voldemort intended to kill Lily. And we also know Snape is the one who rushed to tell Voldemort of the prophecy about Harry, so he was still very much a Death Eater at that point. He then spends 14 years appearing to be in Dumbledore's pocket (from the Death Eater perspective, I mean). Then, as soon as Voldemort comes back, Snape isn't just welcomed back among the masses, he's in the inner circle. The guy who gave the information to Voldemort that led to his "undoing" is welcomed back like a lost, treasured brother. Yes, Snape is as gifted at Occlumency as Voldemort is gifted at Legimency, but the enthusiastic welcome he has tells you that Voldemort has a particular kind of appreciation for Snape. One he doesn't even show for Malfoy, Crabbe, Goyle, Macnair or any of the others who are not nearly as close to Dumbledore as Snape has seemed to be. So what kind of Death Eater do you think Snape was then? Before he turned spy? To be trusted that implicitly by Voldemort when he comes back, he must have shown some sort of reason for Voldemort to appreciate him so much.
Frederique Gillespie
2023-05-26 14:19:15 +0000 UTCLoved watching and hearing your thoughts veggie! I find it interesting also listening to what other people think about the “prank”. I guess I never thought in depth about the situation and always took it as Black not fully thinking through how dangerous the situation would be or even thinking Snape would go. There is also something I would love to point out but it’s a bit spoilery. But just remember Snape was a death eater he was obsessed with the dark arts even while in school. So I understand why Black hates Snape so much, he reminds him of his family who he hates. Voldemort, the death eaters, and the wizarding war is supposed to be an analogy to the Third Reich. I think it’s important to have that in mind because would you be so sympathetic towards Snape if it was real life? Now obviously this is a book and not real life. So I do see the other side too and that Snape isn’t all bad and it’s uncalled for to bully people around. Also I think there’s a lot to be said for Snape turning against Voldemort even if it’s for a creepy reason of loving a girl from high school who you stopped being friends with because you became a death eater. Now Black was an idiot and immature 100% and lets hatred gets the best of him. I believe James honestly saw that this “prank” was way out of line and was brave enough to save Snape, putting himself at risk too. I always thought James of being smarter than Black and being to be more mature. After all Lilly does wind up marrying the guy and you’ll learn more of that later on and her fall out with Snape.
Karen
2023-05-26 12:28:24 +0000 UTC
