Buffy the Vampire Slayer: 7x19 Full Reaction

This is where I jumped off the Anya train forever. I feel like this was always what she thought of Buffy; it’s just now that she really says it out loud. Basically, she said Buffy was lucky because she got to die twice. That’s the way I see it. I understand that’s not exactly what she meant, but she’s talking crazy—like saying Buffy didn’t earn what she has. How many other Slayers have died, you know? Why didn’t the First show up before? It was because of Buffy and her strength. Total nonsense. Then everyone acts like she’s reckless for expecting them to follow her without a plan. Buffy’s answer was basically, “What are you talking about? I’m not being reckless—this is what I’ve been doing the whole time.” And she’s right. Back in season one she told them not to come with her because they’d get themselves killed and she couldn’t be responsible. Willow and Xander said no, we’re in this, we’ve got your back. Now, suddenly, they’re going to blame Buffy for the choices they made from the moment they met her? So yeah, I had a problem with Anya for thinking Buffy was better. It’s honestly not even her fault that she was bestowed upon, but she still did the work—you know what I mean? She lost so much. Problem with Xander blaming Buffy for what happened to his eye? Sure, I get it, the plan was reckless, but this is what she’s been doing. Now he has a problem because he got hurt? He’s the one who chose—he knew it. It was his risk, his responsibility. Willow not backing Buffy after everything? After the way Buffy took the punches from Dawn? After standing by Willow? After everything she did? Even Anya. Buffy stood by Anya after she turned human, invited her in: “Hey, come live with us. You shouldn’t be alone.” And don’t even get me started on all the Potentials. What do they know? The fuck. 🤬 If you can’t tell I’m team Buffy all the way. Flaws and all.

Mayra Martinez

I agree that there is a lot of out of character comments during that big meeting in this episode. But in the same episode we see that everyone in town is getting affected by the Hellmouth going at full bore. People are leaving the town in droves because it is getting so scary. We hear from Clem and the police at the station about how people are going crazy and not thinking rationally. We even see the policemen taking things into their own hands when all they would normally do is arrest Faith and send her back to prison. Is it possible that some of the uncharacteristic behavior - comments that are more extreme than necessary - are a result of the general malaise sweeping the town due to the Hellmouth??

Rod B

"Then you can't stay here." Shut up?? Oops, sorry guys, but lordy this scene was so extreme.

Autumn Linder

Robins little ego is so hurt he orchestrated this whole coup, HE was the one that told Buffy she needed to “test” the girls and throw them into battle and then whispers to everyone that she’s risking their lives. Giles is pissed that he’s no longer able to be a watcher and run things and Kennedy is just a har headed little shit that is jealous of the power Buffy has and wants it for herself. Don’t get me started on Anya being a hypocrite with a giant chip on her shoulder. GOD I LOVE THIS SHOW.

Omar karimzada

Dunno what this is about, but I forgive you.

Kiss the Librarian

Thanks, guys. Sorry about that

Autumn Linder

It is kind of ironic isn't it? Two episodes ago Giles tells Buffy she needs to start being a general. Then she begins acting like a general and he's like, "We're not going to do what you say!"

Steve Quast

The band at the Bronze is Nerf Herder. They were the band that wrote the theme song.

Kevin Charley

For the last few episodes I was like "maybe she will be on the (huge minority) side that thinks this episode makes sense" as you were anti-vineyard raid and were pro-Bronze partying. But thankfully you see how stupid this episode was character-wise. Xander gets the excuse of being on painkillers, Dawn and Willow have zero excuses. Along with 3x02 it feels like the characters were written for some other show in mind. And as such, they rate as low for me as the boring episodes as far as being worst of the series. Sure, we get a bloomin' onion callback joke, but nothing in the rest of the show makes up for this ending.

Dee Aitch

Please review your comment and remove the spoiler from it.

Lime Pie

I can understand Buffy distancing herself from the potentials (and even her friends) somewhat, she's trying to be the general Giles told her she needed to be in "Lies My Parents Told Me ". She knows people are going to be injured and die. It reminds me of the Angel episode when Wesley is put in charge of the rebels in Pylea and they're going to storm the castle, "If you try not to get anyone killed, you wind up getting everyone killed. "

Christine Cox

Autumn Linder

I don't see how Xander is a POS for not agreeing with Buffy's plan. The last time she ignored his trap warning and he nearly died. I think he's allowed to disagree with her when she has no concrete evidence.

Steveo

The fandom is always in up in arms about this episode and the majority of course side with Buffy despite how she's behaved throughout the season. Look I love Buffy but in this aspect she is wrong. No proof and no evidence, you need more of a reason to go back into the vineyard. She treated the potentials and even her friends terribly in Get It Done and it's the reason why she lost the support of the entire group. The deaths of the potentials and her refusing to listen to anyone in Dirty Girls was the final nail in the coffin. She was so angry with Giles she didn't want to listen to anything he had to say. Buffy telling Giles that he sent away the one person who had her back is RIDICULOUS. Really Buffy, only Spike has supported you this entire season? I'm sorry what? And then Buffy says "I can't stay here and watch her lead you into some disaster." This line is literally ignored by every person who supports Buffy in this scene. SHE is the one who gave the group an ultimatum, not Dawn. Dawn telling her to leave is ridiculous but at the same time Buffy made it that way. The group wanted Faith in charge and Buffy would've left regardless if Dawn said anything or not. Could other people have stopped her from leaving? Probably but Buffy was being completely argumentative and fought them at every step of the way. Faith was trying to be neutral on the situation, even telling Buffy to chill out, but Buffy refused and tried to attack her by bringing up her past. All in all, the fandom will say a lot of it is bad writing which I don't exactly agree with as the signs were there all season leading up to this but I definitely would've tweaked some things if they truly wanted to isolate Buffy at this point in the season.

Steveo

The empty place lies in the heart. Listening to fear, reason is abandoned and self-righteousness becomes condemnation of others, as if that is some protection from it. But it never is; it is just tribalism, a shrinking of acceptance of others. Right is right, wrong is wrong, but uncertainty mixed with fear can flip logic on its head. The speech about democracy not winning wars, hmmm. Was that just emotional defense, or is Buffy just feeling like she needs a win. Buffy knows that the final battle is the one that matters most, but the potentials only see the loss. They had a win in the crypt, and Buffy showed she could dust the one ubervamp in the arena, but they saw her get rag-dolled by Caleb, and two girl died, and several were seriously wounded. A few episodes ago Buffy thought she might be crazy, that it was all illusion. Now the fear makes everyone else think she is delusional, and turn away from her. They choose to listen to their fear and the memory of the pain of the last encounter, conflating the place with the person that was there. So they cannot deal with the fear of going back there, so they collectively gang up and bully Buffy out of her own house. Buffy always ends up pit against the establishment, groups formed out of fear that decide against her, and they always regret it in the end. Xander was being the POS he usually is, after BSing his way through a Buffy booster speech just a few scenes earlier. Anya was totally way off with her "you're just lucky" idiocy. Giles was acting like a british prig, trying to appease the angry mob, and Dawn was trying to sound grown up, and act like she had any kind of agency. Buffy decided not to fight it, because she could see there was noone on her side, and defeating any of them, and getting her way would make the rest abandon the whole thing and leave town. Willow should have stepped up, but her college-girl education saw this as a debate, not as a reckoning. Everyone hates the end of this episode, because they love Buffy, and it is a personal insult to her and everything she has gone through, of course they hate it because it's gross, but she has had to face going it alone before, that is kind a major thing in her story. The old phrase "it's lonely at the top" has a deeper meaning when the person on top is responsible for more than just themselves. It's also cold up there.

spikeysnack

I am SO happy I could take off my gloves. You match MY outrage at this IDIOTIC, STUPID….I could go on decision. GRrrrrr!!! I hate this Every Time I watch it. Ungrateful bleepers!!!

Andrea Frank

Sometimes this show lets the plot overtake characters by making them behave out of character for the sake of the plot. In this case, Dawn & the Scoobies kicking Buffy out. They've faced life & death stakes before, but I guess this feels more severe. And Buffy did jump at the bait Caleb dangled, resulting in them losing big and Buffy getting beaten badly - more than once, the second time by surprise on her home turf (the high school). Desperation all around, for sure. But kicking Buffy out of her own house because they won't follow her plan? It's not like she was a menace who needed to be removed, and not even that big of a distraction. Seems drastic, especially coming from Dawn despite all her bratty tendencies after spending the episode getting dismissed. Wish they'd written that disagreement a little tighter. Wish Buffy expressed her concern that they are the last front & the reality that deaths are expected but ultimately worth it if the world is saved. Wish the Scoobies replied with concern that Buffy's plan would mean the end of them and the world before they had a real chance, and maybe a little more intensity from Buffy to justify her ousting. I didn't like how harsh Buffy was after one potential ended her own life by calling her stupid, but something in that vein would make her getting kicked out make more sense. Really looking forward to the next episode reaction! :)

Kiss the Librarian

Yesterday I happened to rewatch your reaction to ep 6x19 Seeing Red (aka "They Killed Tara!!!") and you talked about how it didn't make you mad at Warren so much as it made you mad at the writers. That's very much how I react to this ending. I can understand what they were going for: separating the gang from Buffy and each other, much as they did near the end of Season 4. But that was done skillfully and believably, with Spike as a fiendishly clever catalyst. This time, the arguments feel believable enough, but the conclusion is ... kick Buffy out??? Where did that come from??? It feels as if the writers were looking at their plot chart for this season, saw "Isolate Buffy from everyone by episode 19," and couldn't come up with anything but this terrible contrived excuse.

DanielOrme

Buffy once blew up a demon with a rocket launcher... Buffy once let all her friends use her body to tap into the supernatural powers of the first slayer... Buffy once beat a God with a big ass hammer... AND THESE UNGRATEFUL MOFOS WANNA KICK HER OUT OF HER OWN HOUSE!!! I would have called Caleb and gave him my home address and let him "Take them all" in my Angel voice... And If you u remember that episode of Angel give yourself 5 extra credit points.... 🤣🤣🤣

Bryan J Brown

And yet they failed spectacularly without her. They did no better than their opinion of what happen, if they would have followed her plan. No gain was achieved.

Andrea Frank

The end of this episode is so infuriating no matter how many times I watch it.

aeronitz

Literally a spoiler.

El

Dave Cruickshank

I think for me, this season really goes to show how Buffy is grappling with the role of leader. It has been a theme through the entire show that slayers "work alone", and whilst she has had success in working alongside her friends throughout the series, she has often returned to this place of being alone with the burden of the world. I don't think she is necessarily a natural leader, and you touched on it yourself when you said "a good leader can also follow". Buffy's independence and courage to "jump in the deep end" has worked up until this point largely because she can do it alone. I think the final scene of this episode is just a culmination of all of that tension throughout the season so far of people realising that they don't trust her to lead them. Though I will say, episodes like this make me miss Tara even more. Because you know damn well she would have stood by Buffy.

Jonathon Wilson

I'll never forgive Dawn (and everyone else) for the way she treated Buffy in this episode. Honey she literally DIED FOR YOU! And you're kicking her out of her own house?! What a way to show her your appreciation...

anna

Love your reaction & discussion at the end it made me a little calmer as this ep is always painful on rewatch. Here’s my thoughts on ‘that scene’. I get the potentials wanting buffy replaced esp when there’s a shiny new slayer they’ve just met and buffy has been pretty cold to them (for good reason but still) and lead them to danger. But Dawn, Giles and willow feel very out of character. Giles seems almost pissy at buffy because she doesn’t trust him. Then dawn who to me would never betray the sister she’s lost before is the one to kick her out! And Willow doesn’t stand up for her after all the forgiveness and support she’s been shown. For me it’s one of the rare moments in buffy where the writing feels out of character but then again I think that’s the point . yes debate the leadership approach for sure some of the arguments are completely valid but force her out of her house that none of you pay the bills for but happily stay there, hell no. If the apocalypse comes don’t beep me as I’ve been fired I guess !

Cassady

Something I do feel like is easy to overlook, because we are naturally defensive of Buffy in this moment, is how that last scene fits in with the broader, Sunnydale-wide events of the episode - everyone's got the hellmouth crazies and everything is heightened. The sense of dread and looming apocalypse is literally driving everyone out of town (note Buffy is the only one walking the opposite direction to the leaving cars), and the Sunnydale cops are suddenly super murderous instead of just incompetent. I think the intense escalation and out of character-ness of that last scene is kinda the point of the whole thing. Everyone's hopelessness and loss of faith in Buffy's leadership gets heightened into a full on mutiny. Everything the First has been cooking up is attacking our Scoobies at an interpersonal and emotional level, and it sure does seem to be working. But i see that scene as more of a sign of the enemies apparent success than our heroes' personal failing.

Mollie K

Oh. And one more fun little fact. The inscription that Spike read was a Latin message written in Greek letters. ΝΟΝ ΤΙΒΙ ΕΣΤ ΕΙ ΣΟΛΑΕ ΤΡΑΧΤΑΡΕ ΛΙΧΕΤ Would be written in Latin letters (or English, since we use a form of the Latin alphabet) as NON TIBI EST EI SOLAE TRACTARE LICET

Steve Quast

The ending is considered by many fans as being the most frustrating, and perhaps infuriating scene of the show (and understandably so). But before we get there, Clems rambling in the beginning is one of the funniest. "You can't swing a cat in this town without hitting something evil. Not that I swing cats.... Or eat. Nope, cutting waaaaaayyyy back! Cholesterol... MORALS! Morals......" Also Spike riding with Andrew on his motorcycle, talking about the onion blossom. Classic. "If you tell anyone we had this conversation, I'll bite you!" Sorry to tell you, Spike, a camera was recording you the whole time. Regarding the ending, I'm okay with the potentials, and even the Scoobies, giving pushback against Buffy's plan, up until they kick Buffy out of her own house. Absolutely, atrociously, and irredeemably insane. I'll just say that the comments left by others reflect my own feelings about the situation and leave it at that. So.... HAPPY ENDI.... well, at least no one died in this episode. *shrug*

Steve Quast

This is my least favorite episode of Buffy. 😢 Other episodes people usually call their least favorite (like I, Robot… You, Jane or Go Fish) are just boring, but this one is simply bad, especially the ending. *sigh*

Minister Kosh

Ooh, how do I hate the Scoobies in this? Let me count the ways. Dawn, was it you slinging burgers at Doublemeat Palace to pay the bills? And Giles is just salty because he's been fucking up so much lately. Faith and Xander I can excuse because Faith seems to get steamrolled a bit and can't dig herself out, and Xander lost an eye so it's a good metaphor that he's figuratively and literally unable to see clearly. But Willow? Anya? Dawn? C'mon, how many times have you guys seen her save the world, sacrificing everything in the process? Willow can go about skinning all willy-nilly, but Buffy makes an honest mistake and it's unforgivable. It makes it feel like Willow has a very conditional friendship. Absolute ungrateful bastards. And don't get me started on the Potentials, like.... goddamn, sit down, junior. You can talk shit once you've exploded a giant snake or two.

Jorgalorg

Two random things I love about this episode --- 1: Dawn was told by "Joyce" (The First lol) that "in the end, Buffy won't choose you. She'll be against you." And Dawn was actually the one who didn't choose Buffy and was against her. Which is WILD. And 2: even though it's a quick moment, I LOVE the moment between Buffy and Faith at the very end of Faith being the one to try and rush and comfort Buffy and Buffy silently acknowledging that she knows it wasn't Faith's intentions and instills some confidence in her to take over... That little scene has helped fuel my Buffy/Faith bisexual crackship for years at this point LMAO.

Cameron Ferguson

Last episode they DID get somewhere: the hospital! ☠️

Steve Quast

I don’t usually comment my thoughts before watching the reaction, but I might not have the time to watch this one for a while and I want to get my very unpopular opinion out there. I think the ending is ultimately the best thing for everyone. Buffy’s idea that there’s something at the vineyard is good, but her plan to full on attack it without knowing what exactly to look for is definitely flawed imo. I know a lot of viewers say it felt like everyone turned on Buffy for making one mistake last episode, but it’s more that Buffy was going to make the same mistake again and they didn’t want to be apart of it imo. I do hate how much vitriol Buffy got from Anya and the potentials, but it’s honestly expected after how harsh Buffy has been (e.g. her speech in ‘Get It Done’). The way Willow, Xander, Dawn, and Faith approached the situation was much more appropriate though imo. I think Buffy getting kicked out is the big point of contention, but Buffy did need to leave imo. If she wanted to stay, all she had to do was simply ask for an alternative plan to prove she was willing to work with everyone instead of escalating the situation. I think it’s good that Buffy chose to leave instead though because she could definitely use the time to recuperate, just like she needed to before to defeat the Turok’han (ubervamp). I definitely understand the frustration many viewers feel in this episode though. I personally think the ending was set up well and it fits in really well with the themes of this season, but that’s obviously just my opinion and a dissenting one at that. I can’t wait to hear your thoughts on it!

Lime Pie

Oh God, Empty Places. Even 23 years later, the ending is one of the worst scenes in the entire show. Still have so much rage over it.

Land Howard Johnston