Time Loop Nihilism

This just gets better and better.

Theis Egeberg

Have you come across The First Fifteen Lives of Harry August, by Claire North? It plays with ideas relevant to this (and is, imho, pretty good).

Alfie Kirk

I posted this video to the official Deathloop subreddit and someone commented a very interesting thought. I'll paste part of his comment in here: "In particular, I think he could have used the conflict between Colt and Juliana to reinforce his point: When you've spent hundreds of years in a time loop doing nothing but murdering the fuck outta everyone, how do you even begin to live a normal life after the loop ends? And then he could have pointed out that this was Juliana's point all along: ending the loop is a terrible idea. It is the worst possible action they could take. And also, I think one thing he missed is that Juliana being right is the same reason the "Break the Loop" ending is so unsatisfying: Because there's nothing out there for them, except for dissatisfaction." Credits for the comment to /u/coalburn83

Mrein

1. Holy shit I am absolutely going to read this book next it sounds amazing. 2. I love this video, though I am sad it made me a little less excited for Timeloop, it has reminded me of my undying love for Omniscient Reader's Viewpoint so I am sorry and also buckle in. I am begging you to read this book. Okay so Omniscient Reader's Viewpoint is a korean webnovel of the isekai/adventure genre. The loose premise here is that a Normal Unpopular Nerdy Guy, Kim Dokja, has been reading one serialized wenovel for 13 years. It updates almost every day and it is the only thing in his life that brings him happiness, and it is finally ending. In the moment that the epilogue of the book is supposed to released, the book instead becomes reality, only it's the *start* of the book, and he must use the knowledge he's amassed obsessively being the *only* reader of this incredibly unpopular and unloved webnovel to do what the protagonist has never been able to do: Escape the time loop. Yu Junghyeok (or Yoo Joonghyuk or any half a dozen different translations) is the protagonist of the webnovel who has been stuck trying to survive the apocalypse (Which presents itself as uhh... what if the gods and myths of our world and other words were twitchchat watching the lives of people in the apocalypse be livestreamed and they send you bits if you do crazy or impressive bullshit, through progressively more challenging trials). Junghyeok has been stuck in this hellscape for (???) number of loops, and Kim Dokja has been reading Junghyeok go through these loops through most of his childhood and all of his adulthood. To Dokja, Jungyeok is at once the inspiring epic badass who has given him strength throughout his own hardships, and the psychotic murdering bastard who he loathes because he's personally 'witnessed' Junghyeok's descent into into be a remorseless mass murderer. If you want to put a finer point on it, Junghyeok's character backstory is that he was a pro-gamer, and it is this attribute of his personality which made him uniquely capable to deal with an endless murdering deathloop. And then they meet. And Kim Dokja's story is about helping Junghyeok find a way out of the story he has never been able to end himself. Here's some random questions that ORV tackles in the course of its run that I find deeply engaging and I think you would really enjoy given what you talked about in this and other videos: 1. Who do you become when you have been stuck in a murder deathloop forever and how do you find your way out of that. 2. What does it mean to be a real normal person who ends up in their favorite book when that book is about the end of the world. 3. What does it mean to deal with consuming and finding strength in a story that is about someone else's endless suffering and tragedy. (oh my god why does hitting enter post!!) 4. What does it mean to yourself be a 'character' whose story was consumed by others. 4a. And let's be honest, not only fictional people have to deal with this. 5. What does it mean to be the person who wrote such a story? 6. What even is a story. ORV is about this and so, so much more, and one of my biggest fears when initially reading it was that it would back off of the hard questions. So many stories like to reach the end and devalue the magic in order to make the metaphor less complicated. Surely, eventually, this book will pull back from the reality it created and say "No, it's okay, Kim Dokja just read a book. We all just read books. There's not really any hard questions to be had here, don't worry about it. Obviously you're not a bad person for enjoying misery porn." But it doesn't do that. It never uncomplicates things for the benefit of the reader and the character. You wanted a fantasy about being able to go into your favorite book and meet all the characters and be the big damn hero? Bitch, okay here we go. Deal with it. At the same time I have never read anything more validating of the fact that people love fiction, even bad fiction, even terribly written fiction full of terrible topics. I have never read a book as happy to be read as ORV. THAT'S MY SALES PITCH. Now the uh. Warnings. ORV is translated from Korean and it is not a great translation. The language is a little janky and sometimes there are just big typos. If you are not used to reading poorly translated work it can be a little difficult. I still think the writing is beautiful despite this because it is very lightweight prose with low description that instead focuses on introducing you briefly to interesting and clever ideas. It deals with dozens and dozens of complex topics and is really not interested in providing answers, but acknowledges them either directly or in metaphor in really succinct ways and leaves you to make your own decisions on it. I.E. the walls of communication that exist between all people and how you still try to talk through them, the ways something can be written in text and absolutely 'be real' even though the mind cannot comprehend it (the square circle), the ways people are metaphorically and literally made up of stories, the benefits of reading again, the fear of and desire for the epilogue. But, the translation isn't great it's a little rough. Second it is uhhh... somewhere between 4 and 5 thousand pages long. I forget since it's a web novel it's hard to calculate. It's 551 chapters, each about 2k words. It covers an incredible breadth of Stuff, because, as I've said, the prose is pretty light. It has a lot of good stuff all throughout but you really need to get to the end for the full effect and I won't lie, most people struggle with that. Not even because they are not enjoying it, I do not know anyone who hasn't enjoyed it. It's simply A Lot. It is partially translated into a webtoon which you can find at webtoon.com under 'Omniscient Reader', that hits the first 100 chapters or so and is an excellent adaption overall. You can get the rest on the webnovel app on your phone (or I have links to other options plus an ereader copy). Maybe this is madness, I love this book so much and I have been high on it for almost a fully year now (I lost my mind and read it all in about 10 days last january) but this video made me realize how great the Timeloop element of ORV is (honestly there are so many things I love I kind of forget that Junghyeok coming out of the timeloop, rather than actively living through it, is a major element of it) and I just. I sincerely think it's the type of work that fucks you up real good if you make it all the way through. I don't know, maybe you are not as passionate about loving characters and stories as much as I am. It does not, I'm sorry to say, have much about architecture in there. But I know you love MGS and anyone who loves MGS understands that sometimes you have to suffer to consume art you love and that it is absolutely worth it in the end. GOD FINAL P.S. what i mean is this is a great video and I wholly agree. I also feel your longing to see what a timeloop DOES to a person, which trigger me into Talking About ORV Again. I'm sorry. Also you are correct and Edge of Tomorrow is the best video game movie. I'm so glad it is fondly remembered by people, I had a lot of fun with it.

AV

(rot13'd for Forgotten City spoilers) V'ir cynlrq n ybg bs gvzr ybbc fghss naq V fgvyy nccerpvngr gur yvggyr jnlf Gur Sbetbggra Pvgl tbg zr va vgf raqvat - V whfg fxvccrq gb gur svany ovg ba zl ynfg ybbc naq vg zrnag abobql va gur zhfrhz frdhrapr unq npghnyyl zrg zr (cyhf V sbetbg gb fnir gur gjb crbcyr jub qvr rnpu ybbc).

Space Attorney

I know you just spoke about it recently on another video but The Forgotten City is a good example of a time loop mechanic but with deeper ethical responsibilities. Your character can kill, but it technically fails you each time, and the typical "second act" section is you running around using information you've picked up to your (and everyone else's) advantage. Hell, the game even speed certain sections runs for you, with the Galerius bits. p.s. LA Noire soundtrack outta NOWHERE!

I like that ad read at the end oh and I loved the video too, definitely something that'll stick in my gourd for awhile

Roscoe

I show some scenes towards the end but don't explain any story context so I think you'd be fine

Jacob Geller

I got a donation on Twitter the other day and directly used it for this. Great video

Is it ok to watch this if I'm only about halfway through Deathloop?

You said on your twitter that you believed people should pay for the things they found valuable, and that you believed this video would be content that you believed people should pay for. I was reminded that being a patron to you is something I have the resources to do so. So I did, I may be on your lowest tier, but I've gained access to early viewing and you've received at least a small contribution. And anyways, my point is that you were absolutely right. And that while all of your content has been material that I've found so much value in -- this one felt really powerful. I actually cried at the end. Also, the ad-placement genuinely was good. I don't have the words to articulate further what made it good. But in total, thank you for this video. Thank you for what you create and do.

Harpyshrieks

That was such a powerful ending. Sent chills shooting through my body.

Jimbleshanks

I certainly chose the right time to become a patron! Like half of my favourite pieces of media all touch on this concept!

LilliumAurentatium

Direct quote from the book, poetic instead of grammatically correct haha

Jacob Geller

Heads-up, potential video description typo? "... and sweet and death." Looking forward to watching it! Time loops are some of my favorite media.

Mikhail Klakotskiy