Statement Regarding Harassment Allegations
Added 2018-06-10 02:13:32 +0000 UTCPlease read the statement here.
On a related note, you are free to discuss this in the comments but I (Belinda) will not be interacting with any comments or messages about this.
EDIT: Clarifying note: there were no claims made regarding sexual harassment.
Comments
David Kettler, you are absolutely correct. We do not have any entitlement to information, just because we give money. HOWEVER: Extra Credits, likewise, doesn't have the right to our money. And I think that, morally, you would be right to question your donation after these accusations. And it is then EC's part to make sure we feel they take the right steps to earn our trust again.
Kakirtog, the Charr in gold
2018-06-18 18:22:29 +0000 UTCThat is being addressed separately and in a different manner, as it is unrelated to Soraya's situation. I was planning to post an update on that later today --Belinda
Extra History
2018-06-16 20:57:23 +0000 UTCNot only is it disappointing how you have chosen to deal with allegations made by Soraya against James (Not addressing the issue, just saying "we did nothing wrong and even some HR company said so" and calling James an 'employee' rather than what he really is, the boss) Now there are further allegations from several others of a pattern of behaviour from James, and Will's claim that the HR review found no improprieties because it did not extend to all staff The statement released only makes it easier to believe the claims made, there is an air of arrogance to it a sense of "I did nothing wrong so why should I have to apologise" If the statement had acknowledged the allegations somewhat, apologised for the hurt feelings she has, and that she felt she had to leave the EC team, then put in the bit about the HR enquiry and then include the recommendations made by the company, it would have been easier to stick by you guys. I wanted to wait a while before I made any judgements, after all, it could be a difference on how people perceive things, unfortunately with the other sources coming out backing up the claims made against James, and with James being silent and hoping this vague and misleading statement is enough (and yes it is misleading because again, James is the boss / owner, not an employee) I do not feel I can support the path that Extra Credits has chosen to take here.
Fried (Fridge)
2018-06-15 21:30:39 +0000 UTCWhat about what happened with Will? <a href="https://twitter.com/Will_Overgard/status/1007332849043820544" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://twitter.com/Will_Overgard/status/1007332849043820544</a>
Riley Gryc
2018-06-15 15:40:56 +0000 UTCI am also super conflicted about this. EC is more than just one man and has been a strong positive voice on a lot of issues. However it's silence here speaks volumes. If I pull my pledge I might be hurting un-involved creators who make work I greatly appreciate. but if I maintain my pledge and there is no greater transparency of what happened and no clear information on steps taken to prevent it happening again I am contributing to a culture that could be directly hurting those creators without any inclination to change. The waters are still very murky and this may take some time to resolve, but I am too uncomfortable to remain a patron to EC at this point. It's entirely possible that this is the wrong choice, and I hope sooner or later I find out that it was.
J-Omics
2018-06-15 10:19:26 +0000 UTCA general explanation of why they don't consider the allegations accurate. Obviously some people will disagree, but in a situation like this, you're really better off going into a bit more detail. For instance (and I'm not saying this is actually the case, but this is an example if this were true): "Soraya provided all the emails in question, and the HR company also reviewed all emails between her and James on the company email system. Overall, we found that there had been heated disagreements between them on professional matters before, during, and after the relationship. As a result, we do not feel that the disagreements were due to the relationship breaking down but were instead a case of two professionals disagreeing in how to approach their work." In general, I feel a good response should include 1) What you did and why it was appropriately thorough, 2) Enough evidence to explain why you came to the conclusion you did, and 3) What your conclusion is (in this example, they disagreed but not because of the relationship). Not everyone will accept such an answer, but it demonstrates better faith to show why you've come to the conclusions you have. Edit: Here's a company that handled this extremely well (though honestly a bit more detail than I would personally expect). <a href="http://oneshotpodcast.com/uncategorized/harassment-investigation-stament/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">http://oneshotpodcast.com/uncategorized/harassment-investigation-stament/</a>
Elizabeth Sullivan-Burton
2018-06-13 21:59:26 +0000 UTCThis is likely to be a crucial crossroads for EC. Here’s what I bet happened. Most likely the statement is true that there is no *evidence* of misconduct. This is probably accurate—one of the issues in dealing with harassment is that people who do it generally know how to do it in ways that there isn’t going to be a lot of evidence. Moreover, there’s often a huge amount of risk in speaking up if you do know something; it’s usually easy to determine from context who spoke up, and that can put the whistleblower’s career at risk. (I have read the Twitter thread but I wouldn't be surprised if at least some of the emails referred to came from email accounts not under EC’s control and therefore difficult to audit properly.) In the absence of ‘hard’ evidence, the default tends to be to assume that no misconduct occurred. It’s even somewhat understandable. Most of us wouldn’t want to get fired because we were accused of something that can’t be proven. There’s also more pressure not to fire someone who is important to the organization. Nonetheless, there are a few things that I think you’re missing, and like others, I am going to put my pledge on hold until they’re resolved. 1. You need to share what steps, exactly, you’re going to take to prevent similar issues from happening again. For instance, from what I can gather, it sounds like James was in a relationship with someone and it went south. What is your fraternization policy? Was James in authority over her? If so, why was that permitted? In most companies, a manager can (and should be) disciplined for a relationship with their subordinate because of the power imbalance. 2. You need to become more transparent in terms of how you approached this. Right now, because you’ve been so vague, it makes it sound like you simply assume that because a woman ran the investigation, it must be right. Not every detail needs to be shared. But you need to share enough to explain why the HR company disagrees. I really hope you folks get this right. In the past, I think EC has said many things that *should* be said, and I think they’ve advocated for a lot of great things. This could be an opportunity to show you’ll do the right thing even when it’s hard—or it can be an opportunity to show your hypocrisy. PS: If someone contends that they were forced out of a job because of a failed romantic relationship, they *are* claiming sexual harassment.
Elizabeth Sullivan-Burton
2018-06-13 21:47:38 +0000 UTCTo all that requests clarification: what kind of clarification would make You happy?
Franek Korta
2018-06-13 17:06:16 +0000 UTCHave you seen the internet torch and pitchfork mobs before? Denying accusations is worse than admitting them to the witch hunters.
Shorewood
2018-06-13 16:38:45 +0000 UTCI'm not sure how I feel about this. It really seems like James needs to take some sort of penalty for the clearly corroborated claims of HR violations and harassment, but I feel like boycotting the Patreon would only hurt the writers and artists and not much else.
Tara Kay
2018-06-13 12:38:23 +0000 UTCThat would only apply to apologising for things he *did* do. If he didn't do it then he should say so (as opposed to what he *has* said, that an investigator paid by him and which he was prepared for didn't find anything, which is pretty weak IMO); in the meantime his silence smells terrible
Christopher Smowton
2018-06-13 07:18:49 +0000 UTCI’m reducing my pledge until Extra Credits provides some clarification regarding the issues that the investigation found and what they’re doing to fix the problem. If nothing changes and/or more allegations come out, I’ll pull my pledge entirely. I don’t want to unfairly punish the writers and artists who contribute to Extra History, but given the nature of the existing allegations, I can’t continue funding EC at the level I have been.
Kacie Rowlette
2018-06-12 22:39:34 +0000 UTC*watches the pitchforks come out* guilty until proven innocent seems to be the name of the day and I am quite sick of it. They got a 3rd party to take a look and found no wrong doing. People don't realize that a public apology is an admission of guilt and thus usable in a court of law in case she wants to sue him. Its why the accused always release these extremely neutral statements. Its the only way to protect themselves. If the accusation was serious she would have gone to a lawyer not to twitter to lodge her complaints.
Shorewood
2018-06-12 22:24:27 +0000 UTCI stopped my funding because of the way James is handling this situation. You need to shape up and can't hide behind a super generic statement that doesn't even acknowledge the fact that it was directed at *you* and not a random employee.
Aldo de Leeuw
2018-06-12 19:05:14 +0000 UTCI am pulling my pledge. I'd been considering it for a while, because I wanted to support other less-succesful creators and I have limited income, but this situation is what pushed me to take a decision. I do not know the facts, obviously, but your statement is too short, and on the other hand the harassment allegations too detailed, for me to keep supporting you in good conscience. Be more open about this.
Matt Lakits doesn't have the mental energy to update their Patreon name anymore, but still listens to every episode avidly!
2018-06-12 18:35:39 +0000 UTCFor sure. Plus if you date people at work it really shouldn't be a subordinate/supervisor relationship as well. That virtually never ends well. If nothing else James is certainly guilty of that.
Jim Land
2018-06-12 15:20:28 +0000 UTCJames, my continued funding is contingent on either an apology or a specific refutation of Soraya's allegations.
Christopher Smowton
2018-06-12 12:51:44 +0000 UTCThey have already made up their minds, the pitch forks are out and the torches are lit. The mere accusation is enough to convince many here that JP is guilty and needs to go. I do find it a bit amusing that JP is getting some of his own after going after TotalBiscuit. Never mind that an independent investigator found no wrong doing. Another excellent example why you don't date people at work.
David Kettler
2018-06-12 06:37:42 +0000 UTCAs a customer you help fund every company you purchase something from. This doesn't give you rights to internal company information. If you think $2-5 a month buys you some kind of special access then you are mistaken.
David Kettler
2018-06-12 05:57:54 +0000 UTCMostly because we fund EH.
Steve Jackson
2018-06-12 02:36:02 +0000 UTCthe following link is to the twitter explanation from the employee stating why they left. I think because Danial Floyd is leaving and the comments made by the employee on their twitter, we patrons deserve a more direct telling of what happen from. <a href="https://twitter.com/Cavni/status/1005515831998963712" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://twitter.com/Cavni/status/1005515831998963712</a>
Steve Jackson
2018-06-12 02:34:47 +0000 UTCSomeone started a Reddit thread about other people making claims against him here <a href="https://www.reddit.com/r/ExtraCredits/comments/8q6h6u/compilation_of_further_claims_of_james_portnows/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.reddit.com/r/ExtraCredits/comments/8q6h6u/compilation_of_further_claims_of_james_portnows/</a> So far, game developer and former Destructoid writer Holly Green and game developer and EC guest writer Jennifer Scheurle have both said that James treated them poorly, but didn't go into specifics. Russ Pitts, his former boss at The Escapist, posted a large segment of his book about his interactions with James and what went on before they both left the site. While some of that is clearly due to the deteriorating situation at that site with regards to Russ' bosses rarely paying anyone, some of the behavior predates that, such as the whole bizarre thing with James refusing to have a basic discussion with Russ about video content until he surprised Russ by taking his call in the middle of a Digipen class and putting him on speaker for some reason.
Dustin Cooper
2018-06-11 23:15:47 +0000 UTCIn the time since Soraya's accusation, several other members of the games industry have come forward with their own stories of being harassed by James over the years.
Brett
2018-06-11 22:00:33 +0000 UTCIt's no assumption about it being James - the allegations directly name him as the only person involved. It's only this Extra Credits statement that refuses to name him. And I think it's that attempt to muddle the situation and misdirect from James that is throwing a lot of red flags for people. In the time since the original accusation, several other people within the games industry have come forward with their own stories of harassment by James.
Brett
2018-06-11 21:53:22 +0000 UTCNo, not at all. Simply admitting that the alleged harasser was James is not "naming names" or harassment in itself, as you claim. It's a factual statement. The statement they put out attempts to equivocate with its use of "employee", which clearly implies that it was just one of the lower rung employees of the show being accused, rather than the guy who owns the show and is in charge of running it.
Brett
2018-06-11 21:48:11 +0000 UTCSo you're saying it would have been better of them to name names and do the things that they're being accused of doing? That seems contradictory.
Crissa Kentavr
2018-06-11 21:42:55 +0000 UTC...And even those allegations are, well... Kinda meh and similar to any not-great break up. Like, how are the allegations any different from the... Well, allegations? Her allegations are as far as 'he said some intemperate things about me' while... saying intemperate things about him in public?
Crissa Kentavr
2018-06-11 21:41:58 +0000 UTCDo any of you that are talking about dropping your pledge have any evidence other than the accusation? I will go along with your assumption that this is James for arguments sake. How is James supposed to prove that he didn't do anything wrong? If there is something other than one accusation, I may have to follow suit, but I don't want to be apart of a lynch mob.
Jim Land
2018-06-11 18:51:58 +0000 UTCI am not going to throw James Portnow or Extra History under the bus. The allegations that I have seen thus far does not paint a fantastic picture of the man, but I am going to wait until emotions have died down a little and take stock then. At such a time, I would also hope that a more comprehensive statement by EC and/or James himself is available.
Christian Jensen
2018-06-11 18:27:10 +0000 UTCI agree. The defensive tone of this statement combined with the details of the credible allegations makes me feel that the organization has not taken this sufficiently seriously. I will also be withdrawing my patronage until such time as James steps away from the organization. I have already unsubscribed on YouTube.
Scott Singer
2018-06-11 18:09:07 +0000 UTCWhat evidence? as far as I know see there is only Soraya's accusation, which isn't really evidence
Alexander S
2018-06-11 17:45:36 +0000 UTCWait - what?
Bill Lemmond
2018-06-11 17:22:28 +0000 UTCThere is no evidence that it is false either. "innocent until proven guilty" is a criminal standard, last time I checked, we are not standing in a court of law. Testimony is evidence.
Trevor Sullivan
2018-06-11 17:05:13 +0000 UTCwhat other victims?
Alexander S
2018-06-11 14:29:32 +0000 UTCI feel sorry for all those who have been on the receiving end of poor behaviour, and will drop my patronage in support. Perhaps once the issue has been dealt with more thoroughly then I will resume.
Highland Fox
2018-06-11 14:19:04 +0000 UTCDropped my pledge, I can't in good consciousnesses support this channel after the allegations against James Portnow
Jo-Herman Haugholt
2018-06-11 07:43:19 +0000 UTCThis hurts. I looked up to you guys so much. I hope I'm wrong about all this, but the evidence just doesn't look good so far. I'm sorry, but I'm out.
coffeelemental
2018-06-11 01:32:14 +0000 UTCIt's terrible, but as they so often advocate, we have to vote with our wallets and in light of the other victims coming forward, I have to stop supporting until they announce a change in leadership.
Tim Zubizarreta
2018-06-10 22:35:06 +0000 UTCDunno what to say, have to stop my supporting.
Christopher Lin
2018-06-10 17:20:38 +0000 UTCIt makes me sad, since I've been a patron since the beginning of Extra History, but I'm pulling my pledge after this. With the loss of Dan and what seems to be a clear lack of accountability for James, my money is better spent elsewhere.
Brett
2018-06-10 15:41:18 +0000 UTCYeah, I first heard about this from the Patreon email, then checked Twitter. And roughly 90% of reactions were claiming that James had sexually harassed Soraya. Upon reading her actual claims, it sounds more like a bad breakup that spiraled into workplace harassment because James wanted to get back together and Soraya didn't.
Brett
2018-06-10 15:37:18 +0000 UTCI have to say, this sort of deliberately obfuscating statement about an "employee" that is obviously James Portnow - more a boss than employee, really, with all the changes in power dynamics that brings with - comes off as pathetic. I expect more of James, and more of Extra Credits. With Dan Prime having separated himself from the show, James stands as the remaining pillar of the original team, and it is beyond disappointing to see this sort of behavior from him - not only Soraya's allegations, but also this lackluster reaction that seems to ooze guilt. It makes me think that Dan's departure and much of the other staff shakeups are likely due to James's behavior behind the scenes.
Brett
2018-06-10 15:28:26 +0000 UTCHaving read what is available to me and having some time to think about it, I’m sorry to say it, but I’m done. I’ll come back when EC is under new management.
Anthony Gilberti
2018-06-10 13:58:11 +0000 UTCWhy should they apologise when there's no evidence that the accusation is true? And why do you want to see a "compelling case in Portnow's favour"? Do you not believe in 'innocent until proven guilty'? The burden of evidence is on the accuser. You can't have justice if you're forcing people to prove their innocence.
Kapten-N
2018-06-10 13:52:53 +0000 UTCThis is really an insufficient address to the very serious claims laid against James Portnow. Not even mentioning his name in your post and claiming an investigation took place without any evidence leaves me heavily in doubt about the honesty of EC. I can't remain a patron of your work when you fail to properly address serious allegation of harassment by the man in charge.
ConspicuousCompiler
2018-06-10 12:54:45 +0000 UTCWe fund this project so I think that entitles us.
Laura Galm
2018-06-10 12:29:19 +0000 UTCLet's hope so.
Guidrion
2018-06-10 12:18:55 +0000 UTCWhile I dont know the specific details in this case, it is rare to see this level of transparency. Humans are messy things and business usually opt for a clean cut appearance. This is the truth though, business is messy and even well intentioned people can find themselves in a corner regardless of how they saw it at the time. HR firms exist for a reason and I think it was smart to reach out quickly. The trick is to not let these experiences leave you jaded, and to continue forward with all the hope and enthusiasm so started with.
Tyler Christensen
2018-06-10 09:25:09 +0000 UTCYou should more heavily clarify the specific claims being made. A LOT of people seem to assume the claims were of sexual harrassment, which isn't a surprised since the words "attacked" & "tortured" are used in @Cavni 's tweets.
GooGhoul
2018-06-10 09:24:19 +0000 UTCI don't know, guys. This doesn't look good. Sounds like James pulled a Dan Harmon, and should, well... pull a Dan Harmon.
Tommy Laukkanen
2018-06-10 09:08:41 +0000 UTCShould this be patron only? Non-patrons can see the title, but can't access anything else so they might assume the worst.
GooGhoul
2018-06-10 07:31:27 +0000 UTCIf Extra Credits is a partnership, there is almost no way any of the partners can be removed (especially a co-creator who, most likely, has intellectual property rights to the show). Without a valid partnership agreement granting termination rights to business partners, the only legal means to forcefully remove partners from the business is through litigation in civil court. This is pretty standard in a LOT of small businesses. If you and the owner don't get along there isn't much you can do about it.
David Kettler
2018-06-10 06:49:54 +0000 UTCI'm certainly not entitled to it, but I'd need it to see a compelling case in Portnow's favor at this point. Especially since this is the route the team went with rather than an apology.
Sifferz
2018-06-10 06:49:43 +0000 UTCWhy are you entitled to this information?
David Kettler
2018-06-10 06:10:57 +0000 UTCI'll be honest. Had this not been posted, I wouldn't have even known any thing was up. That said. I am not inclined to believe anyone, either the accuser, or the accused without proof in either direction. I don't subscribe to mob mentality or justice by popular vote. Since I don't know either of them personally and because we lack actual details of what happened. I don't believe it should be something we as a community should judge. Maybe it is as she says. Maybe it is not. Maybe, like so many things, it is dependent on your point of view and neither are entirely true or false. In any event, I believe insufficient information exists here for us to do much.
Jonathon Wyza
2018-06-10 05:34:52 +0000 UTCFrankly, we need more specificity than this. Certainly don’t stoop to airing every ounce of dirty laundry, but this is so nonspecific and vague as to leave me erring with the story of the accuser. This is not something I stand by beyond doubt, but leaves me with questions. What firm was hired? Can they make a statement independent of EC rather than having their findings filtered through you? Could their findings be forwarded more explicitly? What did this investigation entail, methodically? I’m not asking for juicy secrets, and personal details should absolutely be revealed at an absolute minimum. But as it stands, this statement fails to acknowledge the accusations, fails to give specificity to the claim of no wrongdoing, and fails to pass a sense of genuine independence in the investigation. I’m not throwing on a tinfoil hat with the twitter feed and accusing the firm of impropriety/conflict of interest in its investigation, but this statement is fairly weak. Wishing the best to the EC staff caught up in the blast radius here.
Sifferz
2018-06-10 05:09:01 +0000 UTCConsidering that this official statement comes a few hours after the employee who claimed to be harassed tweeted about their experience, I can't help but be skeptical of this talk of an investigation. How long has said investigation been going on?
General Luigi
2018-06-10 04:44:48 +0000 UTCI'm asking not only for my own piece of mind, but because I think it could be a teaching moment for other employers, as well as any of us who have been seeking solid answers to challenges posed by revelations in the era of #MeToo.
Brian Rose
2018-06-10 03:43:01 +0000 UTCWhat troubles me is that this isn't acknowledging that this "employee" is James Portnow. My understanding is that he basically runs this and that there's no show without him. There was no chance he'd be fired from this. I'm sorry, but as polite and professional this comes off, it still seems like defensive BS when you think about it.
Dustin Cooper
2018-06-10 03:41:31 +0000 UTCHaving read the former employer's account of her departure on Twitter, I have to confess to feeling upset at the accused in question, even as I try to be mindful that it's one side of the story. I really do love the work you guys do, and want to see it and my support continue; but I think in time, I and many others here will want to know about those specific concrete steps that were recommended which you guys are now putting into place.
Brian Rose
2018-06-10 03:41:21 +0000 UTCSounds like this is being handled in the best way possible.
Dan Ahn
2018-06-10 03:38:26 +0000 UTCAs stated by others above, I'm glad this is being handled in a serious and professional manner. You have my continued support, and I hope everything turns out for the best.
David M
2018-06-10 03:35:48 +0000 UTC*sigh* Come on, you guys being in trouble is the last thing we need right now. I don't know what happened and will try not to make it my business but PLEASE be above this kind of trouble =/
Tiberia Prima
2018-06-10 03:14:47 +0000 UTCVery glad regarding how things were handled, at least as far as my understanding goes, and I remain proud to be an EC patron. :)
The Rosamund Project
2018-06-10 02:40:08 +0000 UTCThis is an example of how to handle allegations the right way: bring in a neutral outside party to investigate, maintain confidentiality, release the results when the investigation has finished. Thank you for providing a positive example of how to address these. Now back to the good work of educating and entertaining us with cool animations, badass historical events, and high pitched voices :)
Ed
2018-06-10 02:31:20 +0000 UTCAppreciate the transparency and glad to hear there was a clear outcome, that must’ve been tough on the entire team.
Lars van der Dussen
2018-06-10 02:25:57 +0000 UTCGlad to hear that the HR cleared everything, but that their recommendations are still being taken quite seriously
Richard Hardslab
2018-06-10 02:16:03 +0000 UTC
