POLL - Which version of The Wrath of Khan should we watch?
Added 2023-08-03 18:00:04 +0000 UTCWe have heard arguments for both versions of The Wrath of Khan so we are letting the Patrons decide which version we watch next week!
Comments
Whichever is on Paramount Plus
Aramis Calcutt
2023-09-01 02:58:54 +0000 UTCLooks like the Theatrical version won. That was a close vote. Personally, I'm happy with how it turned out, but either way it is literally the best of the bunch. Not that the others are bad. Quite the contrary.
StealthMomo
2023-08-07 05:49:05 +0000 UTCDirector's Cut FTW... 8 edits compared to Theatrical, but the inclusion of aone lines adds context and fleshes a couple things out, but either is fine. The movie has an amazing score & stands on its own merits, one of the finest Star Trek films ever made!
Billy T. Riker
2023-08-07 03:42:48 +0000 UTCThanks Rich I thought the spoilers in that were over the top too.
Jonathan
2023-08-07 00:09:40 +0000 UTCI think this is the closest Star Trek gets to the Star Wars Special Edition controversy. So many people love Wrath of Khan the idea of changing it annoys them. The biggest difference is all this was shot back then and edited for time. I’m not being critical but I don’t get the argument about pacing. To me Star Trek is about the talking between the action.
Jonathan
2023-08-07 00:06:53 +0000 UTCThis is why I voted for the Director's Cut as well: it's closer to the "intended" look which was planned for all along.
Rhett Coates
2023-08-06 22:08:27 +0000 UTCWe delete our channel
Josh (Target Audience)
2023-08-06 20:19:27 +0000 UTCI just watched a youtube video comparing the two and I gotta say, the DC still gets my vote. More context around a certain character, a specific scene that adds a bit of continuity later on, and more character beats, plus some color correction to make shots more vibrant is just too good to get rid of. And I don't think it messes up the pacing at all.
Nolan
2023-08-06 19:48:42 +0000 UTCWell, the margin is narrowing every day. Currently 52% to 48% for the Theatrical Cut. What happens if it is 50:50?
Numinous2019
2023-08-06 18:11:13 +0000 UTCDepending on how you count, there are 517 episodes of television before they get to Enterprise (not counting films). TNG/DS9/VOY
Rich Wagener
2023-08-06 17:56:13 +0000 UTCSome people posting here seem to have no idea of what a spoiler is and only want seem to want to show off their Star Trek trivia cred. I don’t usually go crazy about spoilers on a reaction channel, but referring to storylines literally over hundreds of episodes ahead of where these guys are is a bit much. They haven’t even started TNG. Use of restraint would be nice.
Rich Wagener
2023-08-06 17:50:06 +0000 UTCI voted Theatrical version. I almost o not care as much as seeing your reaction to the movie. It is my favorite of all ST movies followed very closely by 6. Numbers 3 and 4 are also very good.
Carl Peterson
2023-08-05 03:22:52 +0000 UTCWhile I agree with you about there being too many versions, Star Trek has a fan base so dedicated that Paramount know they can play around with the various edits and make even more money.
Numinous2019
2023-08-04 20:12:10 +0000 UTCNope - the DVD Special Edition included new scenes. I believe the theatrical release is also available on DVD. The Blu-Ray uses the theatrical release. The UHD 4K release includes the "Directors' Cut" and the theatrical version. I'm not sure if the directors cut refers to the VHS release, the DVD Special Edition, or something new. There's starting to be too many dang versions of the movies! lol. It was simpler when there were just one or two. I, II, and VI have 3-4 versions each that are out there. I think III, IV, and V still only have the theatrical releases. I: Theatrical, Special Longer Version (ABC TV version) (VHS, LaserDisc), Director's Cut (2001), Director's Cut (2022), Special Longer Version (2022) II: Theatrical, ABC Television Version, Director's Cut (2002), 35th Anniversary Director's Cut (2016), Theatrical (new color grading) (2016), Director's Cut (2022) VI: Theatrical, Home Video Version (VHS, LaserDisc), Special Edition (DVD, 2004), and possibly a new "Director's Edition" on UHD 4K (2022)
Bret Kay
2023-08-04 19:06:14 +0000 UTCJumping ahead, I know, but does anyone know if the extended VHS version of The Undiscovered Country is now the standard version of the film? I haven't watched it on DVD.
Numinous2019
2023-08-04 18:51:19 +0000 UTCThere's like one scene difference honestly.
Chuck Rice
2023-08-04 16:50:59 +0000 UTCI think the director's cut wrecks the pacing and I don't know why they did it. Unlike the first release of TMP, or almost any other movie I've ever seen, Wrath of Khan was PERFECT right out of the gate. The director's cut was a cash grab, not something fans even needed. And as I recall, they screwed up the DC version and there is a mis-placed shot in the middle of one of the action scenes, it looks totally weird. Original version is best. It will dazzle TF out of you all.
Angelaina Marie
2023-08-04 16:46:22 +0000 UTCThere is a good YouTube video that’s 10 minutes that has all the differences
Jonathan
2023-08-04 16:23:52 +0000 UTCUnlike TMP, it would take a few minutes to go over the deleted scenes from the director's cut after you watch the original.
Mike Rogers
2023-08-04 15:29:05 +0000 UTCDude, there are spoilers in the video you link.
Tom Occhipinti
2023-08-04 14:43:53 +0000 UTCI like the director's cut, it adds a few little additions but doesn't throw off the pacing of the movie. Overall, it just adds more content.
whacky deli
2023-08-04 07:32:24 +0000 UTCI voted for the theatrical version, the few added scenes in the DC add nothing to the story, it's a minor subplot that was rightfully cut originally.
Phillip Grischa
2023-08-04 07:08:13 +0000 UTCI prefer the Theatrical cut to all directors cuts EXCEPT the new 4K UHD directors cut. That's the only directors cut that basically reinserts the P.P. scenes only and leaves everything else the same as the theatrical. So I voted "Theatrical" for this one, since they would be seeing the Blu-ray one and that is worse.
Michael Ducharme
2023-08-04 06:42:19 +0000 UTCI love how close all the polls on here always get. No matter which version wins I love how invested everyone is.
Jonathan
2023-08-04 05:21:31 +0000 UTCAlso, the only cut of the film I have is the 2000's release of the Director's Cut, and I sure as heck ain't forking over to P+, lol.
Nolan
2023-08-04 04:39:46 +0000 UTCOn a side note, I have to say I have been looking forward to watching ST2:TWoK with the Target Audience for quite a while. It's my favorite of the Star Trek films, despite its flaws (and it has several, but not in the same way as ST:TMP). In fact, I was 1 of a lucky few hundred people who got to see a special sneak preview showing of the film before it opened in theaters. The producer Bob Sallin came to a suburb of Kansas City of all places where I live and radio stations announced it that day, so my best friend and I gave up a trip to our favorite comic book store in May 1982 to go stand in a long line at Metcalf South mall theater and get in to see it for free about 3 weeks before it opened in theaters nationwide.
Collin Freeman
2023-08-04 03:42:40 +0000 UTCI wish D cut would win but looks like no. Please do as much synch chances for us D cut peeps. I know some scenes are moved around so it will not be easy but I can get the synch and pause/curse/pause/yeah-wit-a-drink/backon.
Prof Moff
2023-08-04 02:10:30 +0000 UTCI feel theatrical is best the directors cut does not add much. This is also how I first saw the picture, it was much later about 10 years ago that I saw the DC.
Robert Elliott
2023-08-04 00:05:25 +0000 UTCOrdinarily I'd say Directors Cut, but in this case it technically isn't that. The few cut scenes didn't really add to the package. The Directors Cut made a huge difference in pacing and tone for The Motion Picture but in Wrath of Khan it is like watching the DVD extras.
StealthMomo
2023-08-03 23:56:32 +0000 UTCWatch the theatrical cut, then watch the few extra scenes on YouTube if you want. There's not that much difference between them. But I think the theatrical edges out the director's.
Tom Occhipinti
2023-08-03 23:31:57 +0000 UTCI feel like more people will have access to the theatrical cut. (I’ve got them both). I don’t think it hurts the pacing much, but it it tighter.
Rich Wagener
2023-08-03 22:51:16 +0000 UTCI can't decide. The director's cut does not have too much more than the theatrical but it does have a subplot with a certain character that would be good to see.
Mike Rogers
2023-08-03 22:43:18 +0000 UTCThe theatrical cut to start with because it's the tightest. Then you've got something extra with the directors cut to be able to go back and check that out. I don't even think it's actually a director's cut just extra footage.
Rory OToole
2023-08-03 22:08:16 +0000 UTCI just changed my vote from Director's Cut to Theatrical. I didn't check first to see which one was available on Paramount+ (thank you, Nate). However, if the Director's Cut wins in the end, I still have the option of renting it on Amazon Prime, so it's not a big deal for me either way. The differences between the two versions are relatively minor.
David Felgate
2023-08-03 22:06:23 +0000 UTCI'm voting Director's Cut. Mostly the same as the theatrical (probably 90%), but restores a two scenes that make something make more sense. I really can't say what, for spoiler reasons.
tyranusfan
2023-08-03 21:49:12 +0000 UTCI agree with Nate above, the theatrical cut is on Paramount+. Although I've been thinking about ordering the 4k director's cut, I just won't be able to watch until I get it. Not that it matters, I have the theatrical cut memorized anyway 😀
Gary Leyh
2023-08-03 21:45:51 +0000 UTCRelease order.
Jeff Cornell
2023-08-03 20:53:51 +0000 UTCI'll go with whichever you want, I haven't seen either in a long time, so wouldn't be able to spot the difference
Firekrys FWO
2023-08-03 20:50:15 +0000 UTCThe director's cut of anything by a good director is the superior version but honestly it doesn't make a vast difference for Wrath of Khan. Mostly more fleshing out of a scene or two. BTW I'm a bit jealous of you two. Seeing it again for the first time...wow!
James Viles
2023-08-03 20:47:49 +0000 UTCTheatrical cut. Some really bad alternate takes show up in the Director's Cut, as others have mentioned.
Duane Bruner
2023-08-03 20:36:28 +0000 UTCWhat is very strange is how most of the TOS films' box office was earned in North America, with only about US $ 10 million earned overseas on average (apparently). I'm Irish and Star Trek has always been popular here and in Britain. So a good deal of the overseas box office is accounted for in Ireland and Britain. VHS rental sales may have changed this imbalance, but it is very odd that a franchise already so well known around the world didn't have a 50:50 box office split. This is why there was a prologue added to 'The Voyage Home' outside the US. To bring audiences up to speed on events in 'Kahn' and 'Search'.
Numinous2019
2023-08-03 20:03:49 +0000 UTCI voted the theatrical cut because it's available on streaming and, I haven't seen the directors cut
Katie Jackson
2023-08-03 20:01:04 +0000 UTCIn light of your comment, I want to change my vote to the Theatrical Cut.
Numinous2019
2023-08-03 19:57:44 +0000 UTCMy vote is for the theatrical version. The pacing is better throughout the movie. Likewise, there are some alternate takes of the same scenes, but the ones used in the directors cut have dialog that is delivered very flatly and feel off. The theatrical version is Nicholas Meyer's actual vision for the movie. The "Director's Cut" is based mostly on the ABC Television version which added in scenes or used alternate takes at ABC's request to draw viewers. There are scenes in the directors cut that give a little extra background, but they break the pacing the of the film and add in humor in places where it's kind of out of place. For a first watch, I think the theatrical cut is the way to go.
Bret Kay
2023-08-03 19:32:50 +0000 UTCThere's the original Director's Cut on DVD. If the scene you're talking about on Blu-Ray that's cut on 4K is the Jeffries Tube scene - on the DVD it has dialog that I won't type out here as it's a spoiler, while having no dialog on the Blu-Ray. So there's really 3 director's cuts. Then there's the ABC movie version which is almost the same but the scene in the turbolift between Kirk and .... is played more seductively in a different take.
Bret Kay
2023-08-03 19:29:40 +0000 UTCTypically, I always prefer DC's since the directors don't have to edit around any time constraints for theatre showings/it's closer to the original, intended idea of a film without too much studio oversight. I mean, Look at Blade Runner for a film with too many cuts. Plus, I gotta respect Nicholas Meyer here. Dude was hired to write and direct despite NEVER watching TOS before, sat down and watched the WHOLE series and made a movie he both wanted to make, but based off the setting, tone, characters and world-building that came before and established the IP to that point. I can't imagine the same happening today cause so ogten it doesn't. Just quick skims of the wikipedua articles with none of the contest.
Nolan
2023-08-03 19:24:36 +0000 UTCDon't wanna post any spoilers...
David Wayne Fox
2023-08-03 19:06:58 +0000 UTCAgreed on this!
David Wayne Fox
2023-08-03 19:06:29 +0000 UTCThere is a deleted obscure scene in the ABC television or director's cut version of Star Trek: The Motion Picture that is actually referenced in another movie that came out decades ago. I doubt that many people caught the reference. I only remember one or two deleted scenes from Star Trek II. Apparently the director's cut for Star Trek II is 244 seconds longer. The theatrical British version is apparently 17 seconds shorter. You might want to rewatch Space Seed though, but VCR machines weren't really common when Star Trek II came out, so that might actually spoil re-creating the experience.
Chtphr Rrr
2023-08-03 18:48:41 +0000 UTCAgreed, some of the alternate takes are nowhere near as good as the theatrical cut.
Steven Johnson
2023-08-03 18:38:20 +0000 UTC(which scene is that?)
Steven Johnson
2023-08-03 18:37:31 +0000 UTCEhh.. Eh.. I think the second one has one improvement and about a half dozen little moments that don't do anything except slow the pace. It's a toss up. Either way the film is good.
Steven Johnson
2023-08-03 18:36:44 +0000 UTCI vote theatrical. There is only 1 scene in the Director's cut that adds anything to the story, the rest just pads the run time and doesn't add anything to it. Also, I think the director's cut uses some alternate takes of some scenes which were not as good as the takes that made it into the final cut.
Collin Freeman
2023-08-03 18:26:37 +0000 UTCI voted for the directors cut as it gives more screen and plot time to one of your favourite characters. One scene doesn’t make sense in the theatrical cut which does with the DC. Both versions are great though. Be aware that there are 3 cuts of the film, at least there was in the UK. One scene was censored here to avoid frightening the kiddies (and impacting on box office) and then restored on VHS. The TV broadcast - like with TMP - added in some scenes that ended up in the DC. Trek films are nearly as bad as Blade Runner for alternate cuts.
Paul Rymer
2023-08-03 18:26:15 +0000 UTCIt would be the blu ray directors cut
Josh (Target Audience)
2023-08-03 18:23:44 +0000 UTCYeah theatrical may be better
Scarpad’s Domain
2023-08-03 18:19:20 +0000 UTCI’d say directors but that one is going to be harder to track down and watch
Scarpad’s Domain
2023-08-03 18:18:34 +0000 UTCThere's a least one scene that was a crime to cut. I prefer theatrical for movie vi, but the second one was improved
Andreas Schmitt
2023-08-03 18:12:16 +0000 UTCThanks, I didn’t know that. I have the theatrical version and the Director’s Cut DVD, but not the 4K version.
James H
2023-08-03 18:11:39 +0000 UTCI vote theatrical, because that's the version available on Paramount+
FireBall_IA
2023-08-03 18:07:24 +0000 UTCThere was one scene that doesn't make much sense without the director's cut, so I vote for that one.
David Wayne Fox
2023-08-03 18:07:15 +0000 UTCCareful about the Director's Cut, if that wins. There are actually two different Directors Cuts, the recent UHD 4K directors cut chops about one single ~15 second scene and so is at least 15 seconds shorter than the regular Blu-ray Director's Cut. They removed that clip again because it didn't add anything and it caused the music to have to jump and loop in a weird spot. (Actually I think they removed two such scenes around that length, both from the climax of the film, so it might be 30 seconds shorter, but one jumps out in my mind). I don't like the blu-ray Directors Cut because I don't like what it does with the music at that spot but the new UHD 4K directors cut is great. It's shorter than the blu-ray directors cut but longer than the theatrical version, a nice "compromise". The only scenes it adds didn't have music to begin with so you don't notice the added footage throwing things off. The other way of explaining the difference between the two Directors Cuts is that the newer UHD one only adds things in the first two acts of the film from what I recall, and the entire climax is left the same as the theatrical so it doesn't mess up the pacing. The Blu-ray one also has additional shots around the climax of the film, so it slightly changes the pacing, causes the music to have to loop, but unfortunately doesn't add anything there like it did to the earlier scenes. Once you get up to the sixth movie you'll run into similar problems even with the theatrical version, as there were a few edits that changed the length on home video. For the second and sixth movies you might want to give the duration in hours minutes and seconds instead of just hours and minutes.
Michael Ducharme
2023-08-03 18:06:57 +0000 UTCThe director's cut does add extra character development for a couple characters
Dale Gonyea
2023-08-03 18:06:01 +0000 UTCMy main argument is that the cut scenes give a neglected character more depth and adds more emotion to the movie. Plus I know how annoyed the actor was his best scenes were cut.
Jonathan
2023-08-03 18:04:43 +0000 UTCThe differences are pretty minor. I'm not sure it matters that much unless the quality is better.
Edweirdo
2023-08-03 18:03:44 +0000 UTCThis is tough. Either one is good, honestly, but for my money I think the Theatrical cut, save for one scene and one scene extension in the DC, is actually a better watch. Some of the stuff added in feels "off" in the delivery. The TC is one of those examples of a film getting it nearly perfect for release.
Steven Johnson
2023-08-03 18:02:23 +0000 UTC
