![[CLOSED!] - The Harry Potter Book Club! - Your Notes for Chapters 26 & 27 of The Goblet of Fire!](https://img5.xaiju.com/storage/1/rc/lw/d38796-019e8403-fa58-74e7-ba36-05e4e7916ee8.jpg)
[CLOSED!] - The Harry Potter Book Club! - Your Notes for Chapters 26 & 27 of The Goblet of Fire!
Added 2024-08-05 19:51:41 +0000 UTCTHIS PART OF THE BOOK CLUB IS NOW COMPLETE! THANK YOU ALL FOR TAKING PART AND SEE YOU NEXT TIME!! :)
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Comments
Hi Veggie There you go, Harry!” Ron shouted over the noise. “You weren’t being thick after all — you were showing moral fiber! I think this really shows the essence of Gryffindors (which I am) - brave but never thinks, always acts. And that is not always for the best.
John
2024-08-30 12:40:37 +0000 UTCBecause they were together at the ball. But also, doesn't Krum have friends or family?
Jo Winters
2024-08-30 00:53:20 +0000 UTCAh yes that was it! I knew it was something to do with messing up Voldemort’s plans, but got confused. Yeah it makes sense that he wanted to keep it on the hush hush at first, although it also wouldn’t shock me if his ego wouldn’t stop him declaring he’d killed Harry to the world
Andrew K
2024-08-29 22:18:36 +0000 UTCHi Veggie I was so close to commenting on the previous book club, I was going to the week beginning 29th July but unfortunately my attention was taken up by that devastating incident in Southport. Chapter 26 Just the image of professor Flitwick flying across the classroom in my mind is so funny lol. At least neville got the spell right. I knew hagrid would be able to do normal creatures for his lessons. I think he just finds dangerous creatures interesting but the part of him that's the giant side of him doesn't see the danger in them. I love that dobby is the one who got the gillyweed for harry and how he calls ron 'wheezy' bless him. The lake is so much deeper than you would think as well, having a while village for the merpeople also the giant squid living in there and harry doesn't see it. Ron and Hermione's comments afterwards annoyed me, of course harry wanted to make sure everyone came out of the lake safely whether he took that song seriously or not. Chapter 27 Rons stories and hermione's "what were you going to do? Snore at them?". Haha. Rita's at it again (cue eye roll). Ron's jealousy 😆. This is also one of the times that Snape really makes me angry at him, when I read this part for the first time I actually hated Snape for a long time. Imagine bullying teenagers, so pathetic. Of course harry eavesdropped at the end of the lesson lol. Dobby gonna love all the socks and I wish the socks that screamed loudly when too smelly exist, there are some people I'd love to gift those to haha. Love the interactions and conversations they have with sirius in the cave and more backstory too. I like hearing origin stories and what made someone the way they are kind of stories. Will Ron be quiet about the whole house elf issue? Sirius was interested in what happened with Winky but Ron didn't seem to notice that. Do you think Percy would throw his family in azkaban? Apologies for the long comment, some chapters I have more to say about than others. Really glad I managed to catch your hogwarts legacy live too 😊
Liz
2024-08-29 20:12:59 +0000 UTCLupin says in Book 5 that Harry messed up Voldemort's plans by surviving. Nobody was meant to know Voldemort had returned except his Death Eaters. The Order claims that Voldemort moving into the open immediately, with so few Death Eaters could be very dangerous for him, so he quietly builds up his army, and tries to get a better handle on the Department of Mysteries. Otherwise, why wouldn't he declare himself openly despite Harry surviving? The Azkaban Breakout accomplished both these things, bolstered his ranks and allowed him unfiltered access to Rookwood, who was a former employee and had detailed knowledge of the Department's layout. Priori Incantatum forces the wands to regurgitate spells in reverse, so the most recent first and backward. Krum cast lots of spells. I think it possible that Krum was meant to cast the Avada Kedavra curse into empty air (for Harry,) and maybe kill himself to cover up the link to Moody? I dunno, if I were Moody, that's how I'd have done it rather than pat Dumbledore on the shoulder saying "That's a crying shame that is, just dying like that outta no-where."
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-29 19:05:42 +0000 UTCHey Veggie and Woozle! Happy *almost* Sept 1st! Is your trunk packed? 🪄🏰 I’d love to visit Kings Cross at least once to see the Hogwarts Express announcement 🚂 Everyone has made so many good points already, so I’ll just share a few of my favorite moments from these chapters: Ch. 26 -> Neville sending Flitwick flying across the room 😆 -> The whimsical book titles from their library research -> DOBBY! I couldn’t possibly love him more 🥰 -> The merperson with a pet grindylow -> Fleur’s “I deserved zero” moment Ch. 27 -> Ron’s outrageous storytelling, Hermione’s annoyance -> The return of Buckbeak, still hanging out with Sirius -> The entire conversation with Sirius -> Our trio each patting him on his furry head to say goodbye Hope as is well! Cheers 🤓✌🏻
Elizabeth D
2024-08-29 03:36:55 +0000 UTCSwapping with Ron’s feet has me dying 😂
Elizabeth D
2024-08-29 03:19:13 +0000 UTCSeriously! I always thought it was so odd that Hermione was chosen for Krum… Also, how did “they” know to put Hermione in the lake for Krum to retrieve? Harry never told anyone he’d miss Ron the most (but, its obvious of course to any Hogwarts student/staff, as they are besties), our silly boy was thinking of his Firebolt, not a person 😂 Maybe Krum didn’t have many good friends among the Durmstrang group so they chose his date to sink with the fishes instead 🤔
Elizabeth D
2024-08-29 03:15:39 +0000 UTCSo true about Fleur! I think this moment was actually when my opinion (upon my first read through) of her started to shift
Elizabeth D
2024-08-29 03:06:50 +0000 UTCTotally agree with the Myrtle point! I think it’s one of the “lessons” children’s stories try to teach. To be kind to everyone you meet, even weirdos. They might just help you in your journey somehow!
Elizabeth D
2024-08-29 03:00:01 +0000 UTCSaaaame…. I have always been as much of a procrastinator as Harry 😆
Elizabeth D
2024-08-29 02:52:15 +0000 UTCGood point, I changed the bit about him just to be completely sure!
H
2024-08-28 14:29:05 +0000 UTCWe actually hear about the death of Barty Crouch's son, but I just recently realized while rereading the book that we only learn his name at the very end when he is discovered. I guess it would have been too much of a giveaway with what happened in The Egg and the Eye chapter. That's also probably why none of the death eaters in the trial are named in this book, which surprised me when I reread it as I was expecting to hear Bellatrix's name at this point, but we only get it in the next book.
Alias93
2024-08-28 14:01:19 +0000 UTCHi Veggie – the only person (except girls I have been in love with) that I would be able to listen to for six hours without many breaks! :-) In the second task, they really needed a spell to make them able to swap feet. Ron's massive feet would've been really useful underwater! Ron's story changing to a thrilling tale is hilarious. And so is Hermione's response ("what were you going to do? Snore at them?"). Snape reading the article aloud, and calling Harry "a nasty little boy" is A BIT (!!!) over the top even though he thinks Harry has stolen from him. Before you read this book, you probably wondered what all the changes people had been telling you about was. Now that you've heard about a certain person dying, I suspect that you're not very surprised that a lot of people have huge problems with the movie! A LOT is different! It's crazy. I would like to read "Powers You Never Knew You Had and What to Do With Them Now You've Wised Up", by the way.
H
2024-08-28 13:40:30 +0000 UTC"I shot an arrow in the air; she fell to earth in Berkeley Square." A very different depiction from the film version bet you didn't expect dobby and Myrtle to turn up, also nice to know that harry wasn't the only one to take the song seriously maybe Fleur isn't as mature as she thinks and for that matter Percy who seemed to be very worried too. Rita's snitches are at it again and a lot more mysteries to mull over that are really missing from the movie that and also snuffles.
Simon audsley
2024-08-27 23:34:35 +0000 UTCFirst, I wanted to take some time to acknowledge Neville in these two chapters. It’s established in the lore of the franchise that it’s very hard, if not impossible, to use Accio or Depulso on a living being. So, despite the fact that he’s missing the cushions in the Charms lesson, the fact that he was able to use the Banishing Spell on Flitwick is legitimately impressive, and a subtle clue to his actual great magical ability. Next, several things that always frustrated me about the Second Task. First, I appreciate the movies wanting to give Neville a bit more autonomy and scenes; but it irked me that the movie omitted Debby’s important role in giving Harry the gillyweed. I also never understood how Harry, Ron, and Hermione did all of this research trying to think of a way to breathe/survive underwater and they somehow were never able to figure out the Bubble-Head Charm; which seemed like it would have been an easy and obvious answer that they could have found in any book; I mean BOTH Cedric and Fleur think of it, you’re telling HERMIONE couldn’t figure it out?! Lastly, I always found it really depressing that for the second task; the person Harry would most miss is his best friend Ron (completely understandable as he has no parents or siblings), Cedric’s person is his girlfriend (again, understandable), and Fleur’s person is her younger sister (absolutely understandable). But the person that Krum would most miss is Hermione? A girl from a completely different school and country that he only just met a few months ago? It really shows how isolated and alone he must feel as an introverted Quidditch superstar. I do appreciate that all of the “hostages” were fully aware that they were in no actual danger from the merpeople with Dumbledore around; that point doesn’t really get translated by the movie that Dumbledore would never intentionally put their lives in danger just for the sake of a competition.
Kevin Morris
2024-08-27 19:55:28 +0000 UTCHey veggie and Woozle! Theres not a whole lot for me to say about chapter 26 that probably hasn’t already been discussed but it was a great chapter! (More Dobby is always appreciated.) Chapter 27 on the other hand: - completely cut from the movie which is a shame because its SO SO good to see Sirius again - Rita’s article about Hermione is so petty. How do you think Rita is finding all this out? - Yet again we see even more corruption within the ministry with Barty Crouch Sr’s approach against Voldemort, including how he DIDN’T give Sirius a trial as well as granting the aurors to use the unforgivable curses! Fantastic chapter! This book is so rich in detail that I understand how difficult it must have been to adapt into a 180 minute runtime. What was the biggest question and surprise you had when listening to this?
Steven
2024-08-25 17:58:12 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! These chapters are great! I love that we get so much more detail here than in the movie. I find it a little strange that Hermione is the person that Krum would miss most in the world. He hasn't known her very long, and I imagine he has a lot of family and friends in Bulgaria. However, I understand why it made sense to use Hermione for plot purposes. I also love that we get to see more of Dobby and Sirius, two of my favorite characters! What did you think of all the additional information that Sirius revealed about Crouch and his family?
Maria
2024-08-24 02:33:10 +0000 UTCI think the only mention of what Voldemort's plan would have been if things had worked out his way was to not come out at once, at least not until he had got most of his death eaters back (although that is only speculation from the order, based on the fact that Harry survived the duel). SCB have a theory that Voldemort might have planned to return to the maze while impersonating Harry (with polyjuice potion) and use the confusion to kill Dumbledore, but I like S1lm's theory about blaming Krum for Harry's murder. They might test his wand with priori incantatem and see he wasn't the one who killed Harry though, or maybe "Moody" could have taken Krum's wand, used it to cast Avada Kedavra on something and then given it back while Krum was still imperiused in the maze?
Alias93
2024-08-23 17:58:30 +0000 UTCI could be wrong but I think it’s mentioned that Voldemort’s original plan was to kill Harry and come out into the open immediately, taking responsibility for it a so not sure if Krum would have necessarily be blamed. Can’t remember if this was just speculation from The Order about Voldemort’s plan though so there could definitely be more unsaid about Krum being Imperius’d
Andrew K
2024-08-23 15:21:36 +0000 UTCHey Veggie, the ideas of how Harry could survive 1 hour under water are really cool and are fitting to the characters. Hermione thinks of Harry transfiguring into a submarine and Ron who might not even know what a submarine is, thinks of draining the whole lake... Which i think would be the most genocidal move ever by Harry effectively killing everything in the water. Hope you and Woozle are doing well! Cant wait to hear your thoughts.
Jonas (Methanoutput)
2024-08-23 13:13:15 +0000 UTCMoody's plan was for Krum to eliminate Harry's opposition, teleport Harry to Voldemort, revive him, Voldemort kills him and sends the body back. I firmly believe Moody planned for Krum to take the fall for Harry's murder. I think there was more to Krum's Imperius Curse than we got to see in either book or movie.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-23 12:15:15 +0000 UTC"I can’t remember if it says later in the book or not, but how did Dobby know about gillyweed? " - it does in the at the end when the plan is being laid out.
Garfnob
2024-08-23 03:19:34 +0000 UTCBecause Sirius believed he had killed Pettigrew. He thought he deserved to be in Azkaban. The fact that Peter and not him was the secret keeper was a irrelevant detail until Sirius saw Peter was alive and well.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-21 22:44:05 +0000 UTCIt does say how Dobby got the Gillyweed I think, but later. "He went quiet after a few days though, they all went quiet in the end, except when they screamed in their sleep" YIKES.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-19 23:31:21 +0000 UTCOh sweet sweet Dobby! “Dobby cannot let Harry Potter lose his Wheezy!” So wholesome. And I can’t remember if it says later in the book or not, but how did Dobby know about gillyweed? And Percy! For all his rule abiding and professionalism, no one can question whether or not he loves his brother after the second task. I must say I prefer Hermione’s reaction to Rita’s article in the book over the one in the movie. Also, who calls anyone a “bon bon”? So weird! Love Snuffles coming in with the wisdom! "If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals." But also the details of what it's like in Azkaban. Kind of chilling.
itsanursething
2024-08-19 01:09:07 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! Chapter 26 Notes: Poor Professor Flitwick, I feel like every scene we see him in he has no control over the class whatsoever. It sounds like McGonagall was not too happy about students' lives being at stake for the sake of a task. Do you think all of the teachers were in the know on what was going to happen with the tasks? They swapped Dobby helping Harry to Neville in the movie, which I'm not too mad about since Neville is interested in plants. Also, they kind of got their information in the same way if you reeeaaally think about it. I really like Fleur's character in the books, and I feel like this is the first time we really see a good side to her at all. Chapter 27 Notes: Yeah... so I feel like Snape was quite a bit out of line here, what with publicly humiliating and threatening his students. Speaking of, Karkaroff is a lot more worried in the books than the movies (cupboard scene). On a completely different note, Sirius is back! We were robbed of this content and I was so upset when he was barely in the movie. I really like that quote about Crouch too, "If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.". On that topic, it's insane to me that Crouch had the power to send people to Azkaban without a trial. I feel like an easy solution to all of that confusion would be to give the suspects some truth potion and see if they are lying or not. Still on the subject of Crouch, being sent to Azkaban sounds like a very painful death sentence, so it's crazy to me that Crouch could send his son there so easily. I like that even though Sirius hates Snape, he still trusts him and Dumbledore's judgement. Lastly, Sirius really is a good guy and cares about Harry, I can't even imagine having to live in a cave in the winter, surviving mostly off of rats. Hope you and Woozle have an amazing day!
Grace S
2024-08-18 14:25:22 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! One of the few changes I didn't mind in the movie was Neville giving Harry the Gillyweed. I'd still prefered Dobby, but since he was completely left out, Neville was the best option. It even makes sence because he's good at Herbology. I really hope there was some kind of entertainment for the spectators and they didn't just stare at the lake for a whole hour. Again, Snape is being very unprofessional as a teacher, trying to humiliate his students by reading the magazine aloud. Really, the quality of some teachers at Hogwarts is quite appaling. On the other hand, we can see that Hagrid is capable of being a decent teacher when he makes some effort.
Janie
2024-08-15 11:20:11 +0000 UTCHello! I don't have much to add for the main discussions in these chapters. But I did want to say that I love Dobby referring to Ron as Harry's Wheezy! He really said "go get your bestie" Also, the older sibling love in this task is lovely! Really shows that no matter how you usually behave, your sibling changes everything and is of the utmost importance
Ree
2024-08-14 17:18:14 +0000 UTCI don't think the third task in the book was boring, because it takes place in the quidditch pitch which has lots of high up seating. The film portrays it as being massive but in reality, if you're sat in those high up stands you should be able to see at least a bit of it!
Ree
2024-08-14 16:51:03 +0000 UTCHiya Veggie 😊 I'm not sure if I prefer Neville or Dobby to be the person to help Harry out with the second task. I normally don't like the movies changing things from the books but I love Neville so I really liked seeing more of him in the films. Although Dobbys interaction with Harry was very sweet 😊
Marianne
2024-08-13 15:47:12 +0000 UTCHi Dara 😊 I hope this doesn't come across rude but I think you should correct the spellings on 'unlikeable' and 'percy' so it's easier for Veggie to read.
Marianne
2024-08-13 15:39:52 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! Greetings from my holidays in Albania! Keeping an eye out for Bertha Jorkins but no luck so far. (Edit: Back home now. Albania was great!) To these chapters now: I am often amused by how much easier the life for our heroes would be if they had access to our modern technology. We are told muggles technology is supposed to be a compensation for lack of magic, but here in case of the failed library research, access to google or just Ctrl+F text search beats hands down any magic we know of existing in Harry's world. We get to see another side of Fleur! Apart from her love for her sister, we also get a glimpse of how tough she is on herself : "I deserved zero!" after she gets 25 marks for the task. Which for me makes her earlier snobbish sounding comments about Hogwarts, food, etc much more forgivable - as she obviously has high standards first and foremost for herself. At this point in the story, I see her as a high achieving perfectionist who demands the same perfection from others, but doesn't deal well with failure.
Katik
2024-08-11 14:49:54 +0000 UTCThat's interesting, I always assumed Fudge had been minister for magic for a while when the story starts, but that means he has only been minister for a couple of years when Harry ''meets'' him in CoS.
Alias93
2024-08-11 06:49:08 +0000 UTCHi Veggie, Interesting to note that Harry obviously wasn't the only Champion who believed the hostages were in danger - Fleur was convinced! And we don't actually know whether Cedric believed they were in danger. He turned up with Harry already there and the others not far away so possibly just assumed all would be "saved" in the time limit so didn't hang around. Something about listening to the egg and being underwater for that long probably makes you ignore common sense - of course Dumbledore and the Ministry wouldn't just let the Merpeople kill them! Quote of the week: "There you go Harry, you weren't being thick you were showing moral fibre". Nice to see that Madame Maxime was prepared to give Harry credit not just the Hogwarts/UK contingent! Sirius not getting a trial answers a question I had from the last book - why didn't Sirius explain himself after Pettigrew died! Even if he wasn't believed (and Dumbledore might have believed him and stood up for him), surely his defence would have been known by everyone. Evidently he wasn't given a chance.
Martin Wilson
2024-08-10 20:30:34 +0000 UTCAccording to the wiki Millicent Bagnold served as Minister from 1980 to 1990 and Fudge was elected to succeed her when she retired.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-10 19:14:45 +0000 UTCI feel a bit uncomfortable dismissing the "4 on 1 bullying narrative" as false. It DID happen. Two things can be true at once. The marauders bullied Snape and Snape was practicing dark magic. Snape practicing dark magic does not absolve the marauders of bullying him. What the marauders did to him was not okay. By the same token (and this is my main issue with people who brush off Snape's flaws), the bullying he endured as a student does not absolve Snape's actions as an adult and how he treats Harry, Hermione, Ron, Neville, and Remus.
Sam-I-Am
2024-08-10 04:34:02 +0000 UTCG’day Veggie! Hope you are doing well! Chapter 26 Aah, the second task. This one in the movies was most similar to its book counterpart. In reference to the Gillyweed, do you prefer Dobby or Neville giving it to Harry? I actually liked the Neville change. It gave the actor more screen time and showcased his talent for Herbology. It’s interesting that the merpeople don’t have magic or are at least afraid of Harry’s wand. I wonder if they have some kind of equivalent? I wish Ron had shown a little more gratitude when they came up out of the water instead of berating Harry for saving Gabrielle. Harry’s a good egg! But he reaps the reward when Fleur kisses him (Hermione looked simply furious). Chapter 27 My favourite chapter of the book! We learn so much about Crouch in this chapter and about how the magical judicial system works! I was furious when I learned Sirius never got a trial. The way Sirius talked about how Crouch fought violence with violence and many people thought he was going about it the right way shows the danger of mob mentality and how easily dictators can arise. It only takes the belief of “doing the right thing” and “for the greater good” to set you down a path it’s difficult to come back from. “If you want to know what a man is like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.” That is an amazing quote and so true. Also how does Rita get her information? That woman is menace, honestly! And Ron’s jealousy is about as subtle as a train wreck, he makes me laugh so much. Love from Australia
Cj Hayes
2024-08-10 00:16:01 +0000 UTCNot to mention they change the metric for victory by the end of the year- goes from "most points wins the cup" when first announced, to "most points gets a headstart in this maze in which the first to touch it wins the cup." And yet for fake Moody's portkey plan to work, he must have known about the maze from day 1, so the task doesn't change.
Jake M
2024-08-09 22:34:12 +0000 UTC@Garfnob I'm pretty sure they made BCJ drink the veritaserum while he was still unconscious, before waking him up and questionning him, so he wouldn't know he took it. Then he just starts answering questions casually, which I believe is in part due to the veritaserum but also the fact that he's very proud of himself and wanted people to know what he had done (contrary to the movie, he doesn't betray himself to Harry, he fully admits putting his name in the goblet of fire and describes everything he did, because he wanted to).
Alias93
2024-08-09 19:44:21 +0000 UTCI think anything written in the Quibbler needs to be taken with a grain of salt. Btw I was just rereading OotP, and I noticed one of the articles Harry reads while on the Hogwarts Express mentions Fudge being elected as minister for magic 5 years ago, but from what Sirius says in the current book club chapters, I assumed he was elected shortly after Voldemort's downfall. Or maybe he was re-elected 5 years ago?
Alias93
2024-08-09 19:37:40 +0000 UTCMy bad. I think my natural assumption was that he'd tested it. :D
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-09 19:26:53 +0000 UTCThe only people in the series who manage to break through a false memory to the truth are Voldemort and Dumbledore. And both are highly skilled Legilimens. I don't think Veritaserum creates as many plot holes as one might think. In any case, Veritaserum seems like it would be one of those potions that is insanely difficult to make, and according to Snape, time-consuming as well. Although he might've simply been lying to Umbridge. I think there is a certain correlation between the amount of time to create a potion and its cost in real world terms. Certainly, the Ministry seems cash-strapped enough that accepting bribes to delay legislation is commonplace. Using Veritaserum on every suspect and witness to a crime might not be economical. Which is insane, but entirely plausible. We must remember that the Ministry is not competent.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-09 19:24:33 +0000 UTCExactly, Dumbledore tried to explain to Fudge that Sirius was innocent in Book 3, but Fudge wasn't having any of it.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-09 19:12:42 +0000 UTC"Moaning Myrtle actually giggled. “You want to try over there!” she said, pointing. “I won’t come with you. . . . I don’t like them much, they always chase me when I get too close. . . .” Harry gave her the thumbs-up to show his thanks and set off once more,..." Idk, if thats not telling Harry where to go, then I think I need to work on my reading comprehension skills.
Diego Zenhäusern
2024-08-09 19:04:13 +0000 UTCOlympic gymnastics and figure skating. subjective scoring has its presidents. i do not think that kind of event belong in the Olympics, but i am obviously in the minority.
Garfnob
2024-08-09 18:26:07 +0000 UTC"Well there is that one guy in the Quibbler that claims to have flown to Neptune and back." - i think he stated he invented a broom that can fly to Neptune and back. not that he did make the trip as it would take 2,281 years at top firebolt speeds .
Garfnob
2024-08-09 18:19:40 +0000 UTC"I always forget that Myrtle tells Harry where to go in the lake." - when did she do that? she confirms some of Harry's guesses. if she told him where to go he would not have needed to look around for it.
Garfnob
2024-08-09 18:10:39 +0000 UTCi think Dumbledore just asked them. he seams to be on good terms with at least this group. it is never stated merpeople are resistant to work with wizards kike the centaurs are. the bugger question is how did Dumbledore get Umbridge from the centaurs. we will get to that next book.
Garfnob
2024-08-09 18:04:20 +0000 UTC"Why would Dumbledore intervene on Sirius's behalf? As far as he knows, Sirius was secret-keeper." - Dumbledore learned the truth about that last book, and has been in contact with Sirius. it is stated that it was Dumbledore"s idea to use the cave. @Dara - how could Dumbledore intervene? he has no power at the ministry. all the stuff he goes through next book over Voldemort's return would have happened this book if he pressed on Sirius's behalf.
Garfnob
2024-08-09 17:57:13 +0000 UTC"From what I've read it seems you're asking why Fudge wouldn't use Veritaserum on Harry at the end of GoF to check if he isn't lying?" - that is just one example pertinent to this book. a few more off the top of my head Sirius when arrested, Harry about the dementor attack, and every captured death eater about other death eaters and who they know to be imperiused. for some examples. the war would be way shorter if you dismantled the death eater right off, could even use the info to catch and imprison Voldemort right at the start. "I believe the author has stated that veritaserum only works if you don't know you have taken it (probably to get out of these kind of "plot holes")" - this can not be true. Barty Crouch Jr knew he took it when Dumbledore questioned him. also i do not except post hoc explanations, they almost make more problems then they salve. if the first telling was not that thought out the post hoc usually more on the spot will be less thought out.
Garfnob
2024-08-09 17:38:54 +0000 UTCNot to mention the complete bias involved by having all the headmasters as judges!
Andrew K
2024-08-09 16:06:45 +0000 UTCWell there is that one guy in the Quibbler that claims to have flown to Neptune and back.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-09 15:16:48 +0000 UTC"I've always liked how Harry is such a procrastinator because I can totally relate doing stuff at the last minute." I can relate too... It's a trait that comes up a lot with Harry and every time I read it, I know I'd probably do the same and panic at the last minute. 😂 And it's these little flaws that make him such a well-written, relatable character.
Mel
2024-08-09 14:05:33 +0000 UTCFrom what I've read it seems you're asking why Fudge wouldn't use Veritaserum on Harry at the end of GoF to check if he isn't lying? I think it's pretty clear that Fudge does not want Harry's story to be true, he's in denial, so he wouldn't want it to be proven true. It wasn't an accident that Barty Crouch Jr got the dementor kiss, I'm pretty sure that was Fudge's intention to cover up the whole thing. I believe the author has stated that veritaserum only works if you don't know you have taken it (probably to get out of these kind of "plot holes"), but I don't think it lines up with the rest of the books: in book 5 Umbridge tells Snape to bring her veritaserum to question Harry right in front of him, so he would know about it. But who knows, maybe Umbridge doesn't actually know how it works either... She didn't realise the veritaserum she had been using was fake, and her way of getting Harry to drink it wasn't very subtle to say the least.
Alias93
2024-08-09 12:51:57 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! I watched the movies first, so when I came to the scene in the book where Harry wakes up 10 minutes before the task starts, I thought he was just having a very bad nightmare and I kept waiting for him to wake up. I remember having nightmares like this before important exams. I have to say, the point system of the tournament seems kind of strange to me, a bit like the house points. The jury doesn't seem to have a fixed set of parameters for their rating and it's not communicated to the champions that they could also get points for stuff like 'moral fiber'. My rule-loving brain gets easily annoyed by stuff like this even though I don't actually think it's a big deal. :D
Tawny Owl
2024-08-09 09:46:02 +0000 UTCYeah thats intentional so that others see its okay to ask if unsure :D
Benjamin Hütz
2024-08-09 07:05:56 +0000 UTC"Morfin Gaunt dies believing he killed Tom Riddle" - yes, but mamory tampering is detectable. in this case they did not bother as it would not have been out of his character to commit the crime. "Veritaserum has an antidote" - and you would know if someone tool it after you gave them the Veritaserum, you are watching them. Dumbledore was not willing to restrain Fudge to stop him taking the antidote. "Dumbledore would not allow it in any case, because he does not want Harry to reveal that he knows where Sirius is, amongst other information." - so Dumbledore insists on doing the questioning or restricting the topics. o, and Sirius would be free as we would know who actually did it through the use of Veritaserum. Sirius would have never gone to jail. "there are Ministry Guidelines on using it in interrogations and we have to presume that these circumstances prevent its use" - we never hear ant specifics on the guidelines, and the ministry does not seam to care about the rights of the accused. the right not to incriminate your self is a big deal in the USA as the did not have that right back in England. even if England has that right now (i do not know) wizards are a few hundred years behind muggles. i would not be surprised if it was guilty until proven innocent still in the wizard world. "It isn't foolproof and there are ways around Veritaserum." - we do not know this. there was no way around in the books, except the antidote addressed above. all the things about the interactions, we do not know but the wizards do. first cancel ALL spells on the subject fixes your examples. finite incantatem is a catch all counter curse.
Garfnob
2024-08-09 06:59:43 +0000 UTCRather than editing in "EDIT: its safe", wouldn't it be better to just keep the last paragraph, and remove the two first ones? :D Not that it matter very much since it's just two small sentences, I was just amused by the fact that you decided to keep everything in!
H
2024-08-08 23:39:19 +0000 UTCThe reason Potter and Black take note of Snape on the train is because he expresses the hope that Lily will be in Slytherin. The 4 start Hogwarts in 1971, Fudge says to the Muggle Prime Minster in 1996 (Book 6) that Voldemort has evaded capture for "more than 3 decades". Therefore, by the time they start Hogwarts, Voldemort's campaign against the rest of the Wizarding World is well underway. The most infamous Slytherin of their time is Voldemort, who has committed numerous atrocities and murders. His supporters are all Slytherins as well and he actively tortures and murders the same minorities that Salazar Slytherin himself did not want at Hogwarts. If you're James Potter, and know all that and Snape expresses the view that to be Slytherin is good, that brainy people end up in Slytherin, I don't entirely blame him for immediately disliking Snape. When Sirius admits that his whole family has been in Slytherin, and Potter replies "Blimey, and I thought you were alright." It is clear that as far as James Potter is concerned, anyone with strong connections to Slytherin is not a moral or trustworthy person. Its a totally prejudicial view to hold and doesn't justify bullying a fellow student, but I understand why James is not friendly towards either Lily or Snape in that first meeting.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-08 21:47:44 +0000 UTCIt forces a person to say what they think is the truth. Morfin Gaunt dies believing he killed Tom Riddle Snr and his parents because Voldemort plants a memory in his head. Same with Hokey. Additionally, Veritaserum has an antidote and Dumbledore has been tricky with Fudge before. Fudge would have good reason to be suspicious of anyone volunteering to take Veritaserum. Dumbledore would not allow it in any case, because he does not want Harry to reveal that he knows where Sirius is, amongst other information. Finally, there are Ministry Guidelines on using it in interrogations and we have to presume that these circumstances prevent its use, even in such exceptional circumstances. It isn't foolproof and there are ways around Veritaserum. We do not, for instance, know the interaction between the Imperius Curse and Veritaserum. If someone curses you to tell lies and you take Veritaserum. Will you lie or not? Does one over-ride the other? We do not know.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-08 21:20:23 +0000 UTCYeah, that's what I thought too. Or maybe even books on wizard astronauts, I wouldn't be surprised if the bubble-head charm was used for space exploration. In any case, this is another instance where modern technology would have solved a problem instantly: a quick google search and they would have found an answer easily.
Alias93
2024-08-08 18:28:03 +0000 UTCbut the plot holes are they do not ever try. ask harry did you see Voldemort return? who arrived in the circle? then question the named people. normal this would not be just but we do not have Veritaserum. none of this you are lying bull. harry volunteers to take Veritaserum. there not lying may be incorrect but that is what investigation is for. i mean it is hypothesized Reta used it on Bathilda to get through her dementia. so, it will make you tell the truth even it you do not consciously know it is the truth. if the legal system had a way to make people tell the truth you would not need all the rigamarole. you would just need instigators that are trained on how to ask the questions. based on Barty you can not refuse to answer or to give true but miss leading answers. would not work in the USA do to the 5th amendment, but if it was a thing i do not think the 5th amendment would have been written.
Garfnob
2024-08-08 17:12:02 +0000 UTCWhy would Dumbledore intervene on Sirius's behalf? As far as he knows, Sirius was secret-keeper. As far as Sirius is concerned, he killed Peter Pettigrew and therefore belongs in Azkaban. The Ministry traces magic itself, not the perpetrator. How else do they ensure Muggles don't catch wind of Wizards performing magic? I think Severus taught a lot himself. His potions book was once his Mother's because of its age. His fascination with the Dark Arts had little to do with his mother, but might've been spurred by a desire to learn more powerful magic to defend himself or her against his father. Bullying is never addressed or meaningfully tackled but I think that reflects Rowling's attitudes about Boarding School, which Hogwarts is.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-08 16:26:45 +0000 UTCI think they were just looking for the wrong things. They were looking for "Water" when they should've been looking for "Air" Even Hermione recognises their best chance is a charm, which the Bubble-Head spell is.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-08 15:57:15 +0000 UTCI don't think it does and I'd be happy to explain why. Using Veritaserum requires finesse and carefully worded questions. Which is why it can only be used in certain circumstances and why there are stringent ministry guidelines.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-08 15:24:20 +0000 UTCS'mae Veggie! If you'll forgive me, there's one quick point i forgot last chapter - Harry spent a lot of time learning accio to summon his broom from a mile away, but didn't think to use it on the marauder's map he dropped a few feet in front of him? I guess we can see why he's not in Ravenclaw. -Chapter 26- I don't understand how two of the champions could have used the Bubble Head charm, and yet the trio found NOTHING in the library that would help Harry breathe underwater- did Karkaroff pilfer all of the relevant books from the library, or something? The fact that Madam Pince couldn't help either (of all the times they could have used her, I think this is the first they've actually bothered to ask!) makes me question how qualified a witch she is- unless she's keeping schtum to stick to the rules about staff not helping champions? I wonder what magic they used to keep the kidnap victims alive while unconscious? And how did Dobby know where Harry was, to wake him up? Do house elves have some sort of locating magic? I'm sorry, but the second task sounds even less of a spectacle for the crowd than golf. Are they just staring at the lake for over an hour? Ron and Hermione probably had the best seats in the lake- shame they were unconscious, really, although I think I would have been too had I been watching from the stands- from boredom. One last thing- so far this book we've seen Harry in danger of burns (the Horntail), and (briefly) lose a treasured possession (Ron)... sound familiar? What's next, I wonder?
Jake M
2024-08-08 07:04:02 +0000 UTCHi Veggie I took a short break from reading the book, but I've caught up and am back. I am also sending it via laptop to better judge its length. Onto my notes: Chapter 26 * I like that the movie gave the Gillyweed story to Neville, giving him more screen time, seeing as Dobby isn't in the movie. * I love that Harry waited for the other champions to arrive before leaving with Ron. It shows his compassion. Chapter 27 * Rita Skeeter would be a journalist for The Sun or something, wouldn't she? * 'Harry was looking at the black dog, which had just turned into his godfather' is quite the sentence. * I love all the backstory for Crouch. P.S. To clear up some confusion from the last book club about the Prefect's bathroom, it is a luxurious bathroom for the Prefects. The bath is described as being as large as a swimming pool but still is a bath, so it is perfectly fine for Harry to be naked as it would be unusual to bathe in swimwear.
Connor Wilkinson
2024-08-07 11:06:17 +0000 UTCYeah, i do really like that in the book, even though we see just a tiny glimpse of them it gives them some personality like showing their homes and pet.
Jo Winters
2024-08-07 01:53:10 +0000 UTCI thought they were following him to tell Dumbledore what happened, honestly. I think the movie portrayed them as far more evil/menacing than they actually were.
Jake M
2024-08-06 21:47:14 +0000 UTCSomething that just occured to me for the first time when re-reading the chapter for the book club: When carrying Ron and Gabrielle up to the surface Harry thinks that the merpeople are swimming around him to drag him down once the time limit runs out. But knowing that the hostages never were in any danger and the merpeople were on good terms with Dumbledore I think they might actually were "escorting" Harry to keep an eye on him and help him if he passed out before reaching the surface (as they'd probably recognize that Harry used Gillyweed and therefore would understand that the effects could run out at any moment)🤔 What do you think? Also: I always forget that Myrtle tells Harry where to go in the lake. But I have to say I really like it as it shows that being nice to people pays out and also nicely explains why he would be so much faster than the other competitors.
Diego Zenhäusern
2024-08-06 19:54:21 +0000 UTCOk, I agree now. Not a chance Ron the one doing so, unless everything of the twins and his mother or protective side of Hermione not happening. Percy though would have been interesting or the other half of the twin. I feel Fred/ George wouldn´t care at that point for his safety after his brother taken from him.
Embran
2024-08-06 18:48:01 +0000 UTCHe's respectful towards Harry, Ron and Hermione though and that's his only out-of-line comment. The Marauders might've been as tight-knit as they were because there were all these future Death Eaters wandering around. We're given extremely scant information about what Hogwarts was like during their time. Mr Borgin in Book 2 claims that Wizarding blood counts for less and less these days. The impression we get is that being Pure Blood counted for more in the past. Snape might not have held any real affection for them, nor they for him. But I do not see how anyone can characterise Snape as friendless.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-06 17:57:30 +0000 UTCI have a problem with Sirius telling them that and I do not think it is really respectfull to call Snape a "slimy, greasy haired kid" I think Sirius blindly tursts in Dumbledoe (which is funny, since the man did not inervene on his behalf). I also do not see the group Snape associated with were his friends - more likely a backup group or so. Because... Being on the target list of the lovely 4 marauders... he might have needed backup. Said it again - IF the ministry traces underage magic, HOW could Severus have learned all thos and WHY? For me... it is sort of clearhe learnd them from his mom to defend himself (which s sort of sad in my oppinion). That she was so adamant to teach him dark stuff to defend himself. Against what? And what was their home life like if you needed to make sure your child could defend himself. but again, that's just me... I believe Howarts has a long history of bullying coming from all houses (my headcanon only). We see it in Malfoy - we see it in Chamber with everyone in regards to Harry (it's mybe more shunning), we see Fred and George do it, by booing first years who are sorted into Slytherin or putting Slytherin studenst into a vanishing cabinet and keeping it quiet. So, do I think Snape never bullied? No But I sort of blame the teachers and headmasters for not intervening and making sure if you keep doing that it will result in expulsion. As said, not a fan of bullying in any way shape or form.
Dara Jeeling
2024-08-06 17:49:02 +0000 UTCSo ecited for this! Hello you all! Did I mention I really like the unlikeable characters? I do not find them pleasnt. but they are so fun to read. Rita is such a little piece of dragon dung! Chapter 26 Task one was so exciting to watch. I always wondered what the people on the shore saw... Not really exiting - what do you think? Also poor Percy - he clearly is distressed. Chapter 27 Where to start? Again, not a big fan of Snapes "interactions", because they seem unneccessary cruel. As someone who studied as a chemistry teacher... It shows trust to just give instructions. And see how things turn out. They are 4th grade now by now they should have the basic neccessary skills to prepare most potions. I also would like to throw in - teaching is actually a calling. and to have to teach kids who are not willing to learn and to have to - yeah XD I also HATE what Sirius tells the Trio. Let s listen to one of the bullies and believe him. Seems legit! Just keep your mouth shut. Sorry for the lenghty comment. I restrained myself a lot XD
Dara Jeeling
2024-08-06 17:44:20 +0000 UTC@Embran "That I keep in because Neville faced of against Voldemort in the movie. Don´t you remember his epic speech to boost moral?" - you are missing the point. Veggie does not know if that was a movie exclusive. Neville getting the gillyweed was a movie exclusive. maybe the books gave the face off against Voldemort to Ron. we know to this point in the books they took a lot away from Ron in the movies. the short version is Veggie stated he does not want to know were the movies are or are not accurate to the books.
Garfnob
2024-08-06 17:31:30 +0000 UTCOh, good shout! (unfortunately)
Sandra
2024-08-06 17:29:40 +0000 UTCI always wonder, why NO one questions this. Like - we hear waht ONE of his schoolbillies thinks about him. Seems legit? Thank you! I always wondered HOW he could have known so many dark spells and who mayhave taught them to him and why. I always come back to the ffact it must ahve been his mom - to make sure he can defend himself. Which is sad in itself for me. Do I approve of his teaching? No! Do I think it's legit to believe a school bully who trid to kill a fellow student? also no
Dara Jeeling
2024-08-06 17:29:22 +0000 UTCThere might be an unpleasant truth to that. In Book 5 its said that Umbridge wanted to round up all the Merpeople and tag them. So there might have been a bit of Carrot and Stick going on behind the scenes. "Participate in the 2nd Task and we'll drop this tagging legislation." Complete speculation of course.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-06 17:22:14 +0000 UTCI considered adding 'Damn Dobby, how did you know about my secret stash?' but I didn't want to confuse Veggie about it being actual dialogue from the book 😄
Alias93
2024-08-06 17:16:57 +0000 UTC@Embran Yeah, Sirius's treatment of Kreacher is never mentionned by Dumbledore in the movie, because they didn't include his involvement in the plot to get Harry to the ministry. Tbh his character is a bit pointless in the 5th movie, I don't really know why they kept him in. They even had the moment when Sirius tells him to "get out!", so the setup is there, but... As for Rita, I agree that it's pretty vague, but the problem is since it happens in the next book, it might spoil the fact that Rita reappears in another book once Veggie gets to the end of book 4 and it hasn't happened (although tbf I'm not sure he would still remember it by the time he gets there).
Alias93
2024-08-06 17:00:21 +0000 UTCHi Veggie :) I wonder how the Second Task was created by the judges, and why the merpeople agreed to do it. Is Dumbledore just friendly with merpeople, speaking Mermish and so gaining their respect?
Sandra
2024-08-06 16:55:44 +0000 UTCSup Veggie. Dobby to the rescue! A lot of people have problems with Veritaserum, claiming it creates plot-holes. I don't think this is the case. Veritaserum forces someone to tell the truth but it is not fool-proof. It requires the interrogator to ask the right questions. One can conceal the truth if the questioner lacks finesse. GOF27 is Sirius at his best in my opinion. He is fair-minded, thinking there's no way Severus could have been a Death Eater if Dumbledore hired him. He's thoughtful when it comes to Crouch, despite the suffering Crouch caused him. He's respectful of Hermione and Ron's views and thinks of them as people, not children to be ignored. Further, he loves Harry enough to live in a cold, dark cave dressed in his prisoners robes, eating rats for days at a time without complaining. You get the feeling that Sirius, like Hercule Poirot is on the cusp of putting it all together. This chapter contains some interesting information. Severus was not friendless. He was part of a large gang of Slytherins, and most became Death Eaters. Even in this company, Severus's fascination with the Dark Arts stood out. "He was famous for it at school." Severus arrived at Hogwarts knowing more Curses than most 7th year students according to Sirius. I find it hard to believe Severus acquired a reputation for knowing a wide variety of Curses and being unusually interested in the Dark Arts if he wasn't using them on his peers from the word go. Everyone is free to disagree though. Did you enjoy hearing about the 1st Wizarding War? Does it make you more sympathetic to Fudge's attitude in the 5th film? Were you surprised by the lengths Crouch went to as Head of Magical Law Enforcement? Does Bertha have a good memory or a poor one? How the hell is Rita doing it? She's a complete menace! Do you think Voldemort knows how to make his nosehair grow in ringlets? You come up with some interesting theories. Better than the truth in some circumstances.
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-06 16:52:48 +0000 UTC"Harry Potter goes to incredible lengths to conceal his alcoholism, more on Page 9."
S1lm4r1l
2024-08-06 16:44:19 +0000 UTCYes but Veggie has said to not mention things from later books/movies. He doesn’t want to know whether things are the same/different until he gets there. I get that it’s not a spoiler but I’m just relaying what he’s said about including stuff like that. I would take it out personally 🙂
Andrew K
2024-08-06 16:24:20 +0000 UTCProbably best to change the "red herring" wording to "mystery" or something. Remember that Veggie doesn't know which parts of the movie is book accurate.
Hairy Pothead
2024-08-06 16:14:54 +0000 UTCThe bit of Sirius i remove because I was under assumption Dumbledore said so to Harry within the movie. But he didn´t, not even a deleted scene. Rita, fine i remove as well, though that is quite vague. Neville as i said to Andrew did defy Voldemort within the movie. His bravery during that 8and slaying the snake) is what Veggie and all other reactors caused to rise up from their seat and/ or applaud. So that ain´t a spoiler.
Embran
2024-08-06 15:59:12 +0000 UTCThat I keep in because Neville faced of against Voldemort in the movie. Don´t you remember his epic speech to boost moral? Only difference with the book is he didn´t get punished by Voldemort for it, only mocked.
Embran
2024-08-06 15:56:27 +0000 UTCI agree with Andrew about not mentionning future stuff, especially when it didn't happen in the movies, like Rita Skeeter talking to Hermione or Dumbledore saying anything about Kreacher. We know Veggie is really looking forward to seeing Kreacher in the books, and he wouldn't want to find out stuff like that before it happens. It would be more appropriate to make the connection with what Sirius said when we get to the book club about chapter 37 of OotP where that conversation happens.
Alias93
2024-08-06 13:12:51 +0000 UTChaha i read the books at least 5 times in the past... right now i don't have time to stay up to date every book club :D
Benjamin Hütz
2024-08-06 13:10:18 +0000 UTCRemember to not mention things that come up in later books - Neville facing off with Voldemort for example 🙂
Andrew K
2024-08-06 12:46:23 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! As Jo Winters already mentioned I think it is incredibly unlikely that Hermione could not find anything in the library about how to explore under water. Two Champions used the bubble-head charm, both from different schools! It can't be a secret spell only a few people know. In addition she didn't know about gilliweed as well? I think keeping her mind on S.P.E.W really hinders her here xD Also what is your opinion on all the funny Book names Harry has to go through? Remember Sirius's words about how to treat inferiors and equals. I bet the others will ask about Crouch a lot, so I refrain from doing so, otherwise my comment will get to long.
Florian Krause
2024-08-06 12:13:41 +0000 UTCHey Veggie, I never minded Myrthle in both versions. She always amused me. Didn´t find any other character bad. Gilderoy a bit over the top for my taste but I admit he´s one of a kind. Maybe movie version of Madame Olympe the weakest? I feel that people gobble up anything what they read because of them wanting to read that. So common sense of something so basic like Flubberwurms any housewitch likely knows off goes out of the window. Or they ignore it, finding it an amusing error within the article/ gossip. Dobby providing the Gillyweed always made more sense to me. I feel Neville wouldn´t have the guts to break in Snape´s office for one. Plus even if he knows him far longer, Neville is ironically not as close to Harry as Dobby. Likely poor Dobby still punishes himself after doing the crime. I must admit to be on board now with Merphy Napier (a Youtuber and fantasy book nerd) in her opinion how boring the second (and third) task must be for the audience. Not knowing what´s going on. As a kid I somehow thought Dumbledore providing commentary, not just talking with the Merpeople´s matriarch, and the participants not knowing him doing so because of some magical barrier of sorts in place.? Then again just beginning of chapter 27 you read people not having a clue what went on - during hours on waiting next to the dark lake. Yeah, audience wise Rowling really made a big oversight there. In chapter 27 mystery surrounding Crouch Sr. intensifies. The irony of Sirius remarking you know how a wizard is the way he treats his workers. You and precious Whoozle have a good one!
Embran
2024-08-06 09:36:54 +0000 UTCHey Veggie! I've always liked how Harry is such a procrastinator because I can totally relate doing stuff at the last minute. Unlike in the movie, it's been clearly stated that the champions were basically just being trolled by the song, and that the hostages were never in danger, which makes sense since it's a tournament and not the Hunger games. Harry being Harry of course took it seriously, and it's funny how he felt foolish afterwards. I loved seing Sirius again, and his narration about Crouch. It gave us more insight on how the Ministry dealt with the whole Death Eaters situation back then.
Maddie
2024-08-06 07:03:37 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! In the french version, Dobby called Ron Harry's ''whisky'': 'Harry Potter has to go into the lake and find his whisky!' Percy is judging the task in the place of Mr Crouch! Representing him at the Yule Ball was one thing, but now he finds himself basically on equal footing with the three headmasters/headmistress. You can easily imagine how such a fast upward trajectory might go to his head, but from his reaction at the end of the task, we can see that despite his pompous manners he is still a big brother who is very protective of his family. We also get to see a new side of Fleur's personnality as she, like Percy, abandons all airs of superiority when her family is in danger. She was very thankful to Harry and Ron in the movie for helping her sister, but we didn't get to see her completely losing control like in the book. And we get so much information on Mr Crouch from Sirius. Does the fact that his son died years ago in Azkaban change your opinion on what was going on when Harry got stuck in the staircase in the previous chapters?
Alias93
2024-08-06 06:49:25 +0000 UTCCrouch did not order Aurors to kill rather than capture, he authorized it. presumably before that point Aurors could not legally kill. "When people get too much power the line between good and evil can get blurry." - the line is still there, people with too much power just think they are justified in crossing it.
Garfnob
2024-08-06 02:15:48 +0000 UTCThoughts of Dobby giving the Gillyweed rather then Neville? I am sad the films took Dobby out, but it does give Neville a chance to shine in the film that they do take out later. Snape yet again not acting like a teacher. Don't get me wrong, i've had teachers do the same thing where they just put the stuff on the board to copy down. However, we've seen cases of potions going wrong causing issues. Should he not be actually walking them through it? Hermione actually found Rita's article hilarious rather then getting mad again.
Kunzite Blossom
2024-08-06 02:06:04 +0000 UTCI just typed up a really long response to you Andrew and then my computer glitched and it deleted😭 May or may not type it up again later if I feel like it lmao
Darcy
2024-08-06 01:04:00 +0000 UTCGod, you are so right about veritaserum
Jo Winters
2024-08-06 00:35:40 +0000 UTCI personally think both based on my knowledge background and the books, that he is a mix of Harry, Ron and Voldemort circumstances wise pre Hogwarts. Bad abusive family like Harry, poor and ashamed of it badly like Ron and power hungry and obsessed with being special like Voldy. He already showed traits of being nasty as a kid pre meeting James and Sirius. He liked Lily because she was special and he could be impressive in her eyes as she didn't know anything about wizarding world. So he could have someone admiring and in awe of him, which feeds into this idea of craving control of your life through power. People forget, all the time, that what we saw in the book and the movie was one situation, very short one out of many years. It's easy to pity Snape looking at the situation through a keyhole. Same as if the books showed us all Dudley's life post childhood , non of what he did to Harry and Fred and George would only appear for one scene where they feed him that toffee. Then anyone could assume that Fred and George are definitely worse people, as they would lack any complexity. We also know that Snape was totally comfortable during school years with what his friends did to other kids and it was way worse from the mention of it. I do think he redeemed himself completely in the end.
Jo Winters
2024-08-06 00:24:25 +0000 UTCHi Veggie! The Crouch backstory is so fascinating, and obviously HUGE difference compared to the movie. Crouch sending people to Azkaban without trials and authorizing Aurors to kill rather than capture is crazy. When people get too much power the line between good and evil can get blurry. How does one keep going after losing your wife, son, reputation and career tho? It seems like Crouch just put all his thoughts into his work. I wonder what he's up to now tho and what his mindset is like if he's not currently able to completely distract himself with work. I also find the image of the Dementors burying a body funny. I imagine them putting on the work gloves, cracking a beer and then starting to dig with shovels.
Hairy Pothead
2024-08-05 23:52:34 +0000 UTCshould you not read the chapter first? P.S. yes it is in Chapter 27
Garfnob
2024-08-05 23:23:04 +0000 UTCGreetings, Chapter – 26 - see, Hagrid is a good teach. in my opinion better unicorn lessons at least. He just needs to have a curriculum list assigned as his judgment of what to teach is questionable. I do not get the amount of time spent on one creatures. Unicorn for example, one day interacting with the young ones, one day interacting with adults, and an essay on care (feeding, treating ailments, and the like). - Best spectator event ever. Chapter – 27 - is Snape actually teaching potions? He give the list of how to make the potion and sit back. You can get that from the book. He is just there to fix misshapes. we know he is very good at poisons he could be giving insights and tips (examples in later books). They made polyjuice by just reading the book. - love potions are banned at Hogwarts, should that not just be love potions are banned? - veritaserum makes so many plot holes.
Garfnob
2024-08-05 23:20:07 +0000 UTCI have one that I bottle-fed, my husband named him. Then we got stuck with a pregnant cat on Christmas day last year, she gave birth three days later and one of the babies looked like our Doby, so we called 'him' 'Little Doby' turns out it's a girl but we cannot think of an alternative name for her now haha. Her siblings are: Flemona, Cinnamona and Gibon.
Jo Winters
2024-08-05 23:17:20 +0000 UTCI love your idea with cutaway and if they used it more often in the show, for other similar situation it could make for a nice and different humour style
Jo Winters
2024-08-05 23:15:17 +0000 UTCTwo Dobby’s! Brilliant 😃
Andrew K
2024-08-05 23:10:12 +0000 UTCSomeone might know more than me on this, but I’d like to know the timeline of Snape being bullied. If being picked on led him down a dark path which led to him meddling in dark arts, there’s definitely a lot of sympathy you can have for him. However, if he was already doing that, it’s harder to feel sorry for him. I know bullying in any scenario is bad, but for instance if in the real world someone was getting involved in something which facilitated an entire war and the murder of innocent people, I would think “you deserve it, no sympathy.” If it’s the other way round I would still condemn them for getting involved in all the bad stuff, but I’d feel sorry for them that the bullying led them down that path initially. Maybe someone in the comments can enlighten me if they know whether it was the bullying or the dark arts which came first
Andrew K
2024-08-05 23:08:33 +0000 UTCHi Veggie hope you’re doing great! I’ll let everyone else cover the most important & controversial (Snape) parts of these chapters, so here’s a few lighter points. - In the TV show, I want to see a cutaway to an aqualung zooming across the countryside. - It was nice seeing Dobby again but I think the movie’s choice of Neville helping with the gillyweed was a good substitute. We got nice comedic moments and Neville got more screen time. - I’d love to hear Dumbledore speak Mermish, could you imagine Michael Gambon making all those weird noises. (Also how unfair is it that the judges are the headteachers? So much bias) - I wonder if Sirius checked to see if the rats had all their toes before he ate them, in case he ate Peter Pettigrew by accident. P.S. your favourite retuned at SummerSlam - hope you enjoyed it!
Andrew K
2024-08-05 23:02:25 +0000 UTCSnape is Heathcliff to me. There are so many similarities between their characters. That's one of the reasons I love this character because Wuthering Heights is my favourite book and not a romance as many think it is. And Heathcliff is not a good man but a fascinating one. I agree with you.
Jo Winters
2024-08-05 22:53:47 +0000 UTCHello Veggie! I love when you mention your dog in your videos and the name is so adorable. I love animals, I have 17 rescued cats but I'm not as good at making cute names. I have two Dobbys for example! Chapter 26 I'm questioning two things here: Hermione's ability to research and Hogwarts' library. It's so unlikely that there is nothing in that library about any methods. It cannot be that rare for wizards to go underwater. Even in books about Merpeople some explorers must have gone meet them. I'm so interested in the life of the merpeople and their dwellings. I would have loved to be able to explore the lake in some game and meet them. Do you find them interesting? From the mentions of lessons with Professor Flitwick, I think he is probably a great head of house. I think probably the one I would like to have if I was a student. Chapter 27 Snape is acting so inappropriately for a teacher, but the line "Harry Potter’s Secret Heartache… dear, dear. Potter, what’s ailing you now?" is gold. I hope it makes it to the new series. Snape is so arrogant. He acts as if he is the victim, not the boy who was orphaned by his ex-idol. I love his character, but he's a terrible person, which is true for many people who are effective in war. The way he calls Harry nasty for breaking the rules while he himself broke serious laws and joined the worst criminal organisation in their world. I like the quote from Sirius about getting a measure of people from how they treat those below them. What do you think of Mr Crouch now, as we know more about his background? What do you think about the information that Barty Jr. died in prison? We never got that in the movie.
Jo Winters
2024-08-05 22:48:07 +0000 UTCHey Veggie! Were you excited to see Dobby? I actually don’t hate the change to Neville in the movie as it gives him a chance to shine and for the audience to see his herbology skills. How do you think Rita Skeeter is learning personal info about everyone? Or do you think she’s making it all up and occasionally getting lucky? Also, I’ve had this image in my head of Snuffles the dog in this cave for years and I forgot it’s from this chapter. Earlier in the book, when they were writing letters, you talked about where you thought Sirius was. You talked about picturing him on a tropical island somewhere. I was picturing him in a cave and had no idea why, now I’m realizing the image is from this chapter burned into my brain 15 years ago. We get some really important info here that Snape was doing dark magic as a student. I have strong opinions on Snape but don’t get into them too much in the book club because other people typically cover whatever I’m thinking. But I think it’s really important to note this here. The 4 on 1 bullying narrative is really not true at all. Snape as a child was not an innocent, nerdy kid getting picked on. He was teaching himself dark magic. There’s more to discuss about this that I’ll save for later in the series. If you hadn’t seen the movies, who would you guess put Harry’s name in the Goblet of Fire? Also, a few book clubs ago someone brought up the idea of an in person meet up. I think this would be so fun! I’m in the US unfortunately but honestly I would be down to go the UK and make a vacation out of it, or maybe you could do something at a LeakyCon (HP convention).
Darcy
2024-08-05 22:36:05 +0000 UTCHey Veggie, im not 100% sure if its in this Chapter. If not, somebody will let me know and i will delete the comment. Edit: Its safe, so read ahead :) I really like that we hear the perspective of Ron and Hermione what really happened the night before the second task. That Dumbledore assured them that they would be safe and that no harm would come to them. In the movie we are told that they were in real danger... something which Dumbledore would have never allowed.
Benjamin Hütz
2024-08-05 20:03:23 +0000 UTC
