Talking Simpsons - Lisa's Substitute With Emily VanDerWerff

On the ending - I agree with your guest about the reality of being in a relationship that you can't walk away from but need to find common ground on. Lisa cannot leave her home. She is stuck living with her father & if the conflict between them wasn't resolved by the end of the episode then you're left knowing she's stuck in an abusive relationship. That's a bitter pill to swallow. Vitti did a great job salvaging Lisa & Homer's connection. You guys are right that later episodes just piss on Lisa's self worth & make her the target for Homer's ridicule but this one has a satisfying ending.

James Babbo

I think the cowboy bit would be a reference to Hoffman's 1970 "Little Big Man"

John Harrison

I just wanna give attention to the perfect craftsmanship of Principal Skinner’s line “No, children, you’re not seeing things. This, my little friends, is a schwa.” Even this early in the series they already had Skinner’s very specific degree of boringness nailed down, and this line cracks me up every time.

I've definitely been a little hard on Season 2 when it gets sentimental, heartfelt, etc, but I will give credit where credit is due as this episode works very well. And I especially like how it comes to a head during the last act. Homer's line to Lisa about not caring is quite possibly the most hurtful thing he says in the series. It's mean on the surface, but it also comes from such a place of honesty for Homer that makes it really cut deep. The pivot to Homer at the end is clumsy and is always something that surprises me in re-watches as I'm invested in Lisa, and suddenly we're with Homer. At the same time, we have to have something for Homer because we can't just leave him after the table scene and have any respect for him. I think we could have had the scenes between him and Bart and him and Lisa and dropped the scene with Marge in favor of something with Lisa. What that something would be I don't know as her story is over. Unless we want to have Mr. Bergstrom go full Mary Poppins and fly by her window or appear in the sky or something. Maybe a diary scene was on the table, but felt too Doogie Howser. It is a bit of honest cruelty to have her story just end though as in real life when a teacher or someone just up and leaves - they're gone, and you're just left to move on. This is a good episode even without perfectly sticking the landing and I think it's still my favorite Lisa episode 30 years later.

Joe Hodgson

This is a wonderful episode that's a real classic for a reason, but listening to it in podcast form always makes me appreciate the performances so much more. I think Bob/Henry are judging Homer a little too harshly in this episode because of what he eventually becomes. This is episode is one of the better portrayals of Homer as more of a callous dad than being a monster who doesn't care about anything. I do think Vitti channels a lot of honesty in Homer here where he's aware that other people are better and smarter than him. It makes the way he and Lisa patch up, especially when Lisa says "I'm sorry I called you a Baboon" that feels so earned at the end rather than a completely forgiven "I love you." And I do have to jump along with everyone saying that Emily was a lovely guest. And she'll be happy to know that there is an awards contender this year called CODA that does feature more of the Good Teacher/Mr. Bergstrom dynamic we'd like to see again.

SilkiePJ

If they wanted to reference Midnight Cowboy, Mr. Bergstrom would be a... very different kind of cowboy

nina matsumoto

This is a great Simpsons episode but I am glad that they didn't make more in this vein. Along with Bart Gets an F and the Blowfish episode, its almost unique in the series in how it becomes a straight drama, with the comedy coming to a standstill. There's a few later episodes with equally emotional moments (Like Father, Like Clown; Lisa on Ice; Lisa's Wedding; Mother Simpson; etc) but these are usually undercut with cynicism and jokes (e.g. the crowd rioting in Lisa on Ice). Even if they had wanted to commit to more dramatic episodes later in the series, I don't think they would have been able to pull them off as successfully without James L Brooks being as involved. Thank goodness they never attempted to bring Mr Bergstrom back either, though I think there was one season 15 episode which referenced him. Unlike Vitti, I think that the "You are Lisa Simpson" note works better without the exclamation mark. Also I like to think that 'baboon' was originally 'bastard' in the script.

Nick Mould

Seconded! Emily's knoweldge of/experience with comedy writing added a lot, and she's always a delight on every podcast I've heard her on. (She's the guest on the Bechdel Cast this week too, where they cover "The Matrix" if anyone is interested.)

Kat Heagberg

Thanks for the podcast, folks! Emily was such a great guest! ^_^

To Boldy Joe... Moore

1. Wonder how much of the Cowboy stuff here is due to Hoffman being in Midnight Cowboy 2. On the topic of teachers letting you play videos, I’m reminded of what happened to me in Advanced English sophomore year of high school. I was to give a presentation to the class on Stanley Kubrick, and visual aids were a requirement. My paper cited my three films: Full Metal Jacket, 2001, and A Clockwork Orange (hey I was a 16 year old dude). I rented all three from Blockbuster and I planned to show clips from both FMJ and 2001. However, I put the wrong VHS in the boxes, and when I went to play my 2001 clip, it was A Clockwork Orange instead. And uhh an unsavory one at that, one of the scenes Alec was forced to watch with his eyes held open…my teacher saw right away and (thankfully) laughed; my status as teachers favorite surely helped. My classmates didn’t have time to take notice, and luckily I was able to recover and still get an A in the process. Aforementioned teacher was a Kubrick fan (and he knew what scene I started playing) and gave me a “nice recovery” comment as we left class that day. Thank you to your podcast for unlocking this memory for me!

Manu

As the father of a 7 year old I can say with confidence, little girls are definitely not dying their shoes lol

In the '90s Payless had this "dyable" shoe line—they were white satin and the idea was you could easily dye them to match an outfit. When we'd go shopping for Easter shoes I'd ask my mom if I could get them and she would always say no, that she didn't need any extra work and that those shoes were probably for weddings (like to match bridal party dresses) and not Easter. That doesn't totally explain why Lisa was asking to dye shoes she already owned (I think you could probably only dye them once?) but it does confirm that dying shoes was at least a thing around this time. At least among the middle-class Payless shoppers.

Kat Heagberg

When I was in elementary school in the 2000s, our schools still forced us to read Charlotte's Web. The 2006 film was new at that time so we got to tie that into our reading. I was genuinely obsessed with that book and I remember getting a combo pack of the 2006 film on DVD and a copy of the book. I hadn't seen the 1973 Hanna-Barbera film in full 'till I randomly saw it on Netflix in 2019. Paul Lynde is the best part of the movie.

tiny crow